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sid_guardian2023-07-06 11:47 pm
trobadora) wrote in sid_guardian2023-07-06 11:47 pm
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GUARDIAN REWATCH - Episode 25
Beginning of episode: Zhao Yunlan and Guo Changcheng question the taxi driver; Guo Changcheng is infected with black energy
Ending of episode: Shen Wei and Zhao Yunlan arrive at Shen Wei's flat; something smells burnt
Important scenes/developments:
- Zhao Yunlan and Guo Changcheng question the taxi driver; Guo Changcheng is infected with black energy
- Guo Changcheng doesn't want people to touch his diary and becomes aggressive
- Zhu Hong tries to confess her feelings, and turns shy and weepy
- Zhao Yunlan talks to Dr Cheng and finds out about Kong Jing and his 99 personalities
- Zhao Yunlan and Shen Wei arrive at the SID and are appalled by the changes in Chu Shuzhi
- Shen Wei decides to go to Dixing; Zhao Yunlan playacts a changed personality, and Shen Wei is decidedly unimpressed
- Shen Wei consults the Regent in Dixing; the Regent tells him to find the source
- Zhu Hong whines, Da Qing rejects junk food, but Lin Jing is unchanged
- Zhu Hao confirms Kong Jing freed him from prison; before he can explain more about Kong Jing, Ya Qing kills him with a dart
- Zhao Yunlan is captured by Kong Jing
- Kong Jing tries to transfer his personality into Zhao Yunlan; Shen Wei arrives in time
- Kong Jing's original personality wants to die; Ya Qing kills him with a dart
- Wang Xiangyang draws the 30th symbol to weaken the energy seal that holds Ye Zun
- Zhao Yunlan asks Dr Cheng about remaining unchanged during the personality swap
- Lin Jing finds a syringe at the crime scene, and almost hides it
- Guo Changcheng visits Kong Jing's grave, and witnesses Dong Nan's death; Ya Qing offers him a token
- Shen Wei and Zhao Yunlan arrive at Shen Wei's flat; something smells burnt
Thoughts:
- The personality change case: this is one of my least favourites because a lot of it hits my embarrassment squick, but there's a lot of good stuff in this as well! So I'll focus mostly on that. However, I do have some things to say about the personality changes!
- During the interrogation scene, immediately after the black energy got into him, Guo Changcheng still seemed himself. But when he stomps back into the main room, his body language is notably changed. It's really impressive! Interestingly, he doesn't protest when Chu Shuzhi grabs his diary - he only gets aggressive when Zhu Hong reaches for it. (And personality change or no, Xiao-Guo has every right to be pissed off at people trying to read his diary, but perhaps Lao-Chu has permission? At any rate, he's read it before, and Xiao-Guo knows.) Of course, then Guo Changcheng nearly starts a fight with Chu Shuzhi anyway, in response to Chu Shuzhi's usual behaviour.
- Which means that Guo Changcheng has now touched Zhu Hong and Chu Shuzhi both, infecting them. (In fact, we see Chu Shuzhi blinking heavily at the end of the scene, clearly feeling something off already.)
- What stood out to me this time was how, in contrast to the dramatic changes in personality, certain core aspects remain the same: Guo Changcheng and Chu Shuzhi still work together; Chu Shuzhi still protects Guo Changcheng - even if now he's trying to stop Zhao Yunlan from responding to Guo Changcheng's aggression, he still physically gets in the way too! And Zhu Hong's feelings for Zhao Yunlan are unchanged, even if she now gets weepy and whiny and shy over it.
- In other respects, the dynamic between Chu Shuzhi and Guo Changcheng has simply switched - one of them is the gruff, physically rough one; the other stumbles over his own feet and is emotionally sensitive. (Of course Chu Shuzhi's flavour is rather different from Guo Changcheng's. *g*)
- It's also fascinating how the personality changes affect people physically - I don't mean the body language, but the way Guo Changcheng suddenly knows how to throw a punch, while Chu Shuzhi gets out of breath chasing someone, and can barely manage to hold on to one of his strings.
- There are a lot of excellent reaction shots to the personality changes, from everyone boggling at Guo Changcheng's aggressiveness (Lao-Chu stares open-mouthed!) to Zhao Yunlan screaming at the heavens. :D
On the other hand - well, it's very understandable that Zhao Yunlan and Shen Wei are deeply disturbed by the changes in Chu Shuzhi, but the way they express it is extremely unpleasant, Zhao Yunlan saying he would never have accepted such a person at the SID, and Shen Wei saying this is worse than killing Chu Shuzhi. Ugh.
- During the interrogation scene, immediately after the black energy got into him, Guo Changcheng still seemed himself. But when he stomps back into the main room, his body language is notably changed. It's really impressive! Interestingly, he doesn't protest when Chu Shuzhi grabs his diary - he only gets aggressive when Zhu Hong reaches for it. (And personality change or no, Xiao-Guo has every right to be pissed off at people trying to read his diary, but perhaps Lao-Chu has permission? At any rate, he's read it before, and Xiao-Guo knows.) Of course, then Guo Changcheng nearly starts a fight with Chu Shuzhi anyway, in response to Chu Shuzhi's usual behaviour.
- We continue the arc of Zhu Hong's feelings for Zhao Yunlan:
- Personality-changed Zhu Hong, shy and weepy in a way she usually isn't, but also more actively trying to pursue him than she usually does, tries to confess. She goes so far as to grab his arm when he tries to walk away - only to then run away crying, unable to get it out after all. Her entire body language is so unlike her usual confidence! (amedia said on discord: "The clingier/weepier OOC Zhu Hong gets, the more I figure they're trying to show her real self is badass." I think that's spot on.)
- Zhao Yunlan continues to refuse to acknowledge her feelings. When she approaches him, his reaction is an immediate, RETREAT RETREAT RETREAT, and he tries to escape saying he needs to go to the hospital.
- Shen Wei, meanwhile, is very "I'm staying out of this" about it all: Zhao Yunlan looks at him twice during this, and each time Shen Wei immediately turns away to look at his papers. He's brought the issue up to Zhao Yunlan before, but he clearly thinks Zhao Yunlan needs to deal with this on his own.
- Personality-changed Zhu Hong, shy and weepy in a way she usually isn't, but also more actively trying to pursue him than she usually does, tries to confess. She goes so far as to grab his arm when he tries to walk away - only to then run away crying, unable to get it out after all. Her entire body language is so unlike her usual confidence! (
- Zhao Yunlan's capture/captivity/rescue is a delight:
- I love that he manages to drop a lollipop before Kong Jing knocks him out!
(I also love that Guo Changcheng finds it, then promptly throws it away again, making it bounce off the wall!) - The entire set-up is really creepy, Kong Jing with his assortment of ... implements, drilling a hole into a board. And he manages to be threatening with a feather duster! (Zhao Yunlan flinches every time he smacks it against something!)
- One of my favourite bits of this scene is Zhao Yunlan's fast-talking, the way he gets into Kong Jing's head and hits the sore spot there about people not believing him about his 99 personalities.
Kong Jing falls to his knees: "You got it! You're my best friend forever!"
(I want to point out what he calls him in Chinese is his 知音 zhīyīn. See this post for an explanation of this and related terms.)
And I also love that then his fast-talking promptly gets Zhao Yunlan into trouble when he commiserates with Kong Jin over being stuck in his body (presumably with all the other personalities) and says, "But you know you can't transfer your personality, right?"
The moment it's out of his mouth, he realises he's just given Kong Jing an idea, and for a moment he grimaces, losing control of his mask. - When Kong Jing switches personalities after being thrown back, Zhao Yunlan is back to working on saving himself by talking: Kong Jing wants to die, so he convinces Kong Jing to free him, so Zhao Yunlan can kill him. It almost works! But Kong Jing switches personalities again and strangles him, so Shen Wei gets to come to the rescue after all.
The watch Lin Jing gave Zhao Yunlan beeps, and Shen Wei kicks Kong Jing across the room. (Interestingly, he doesn't use black energy or anything, just a well-applied boot.)
Shen Wei: Sorry I'm late.
Zhao Yunlan: You're still on time.
This is plural "you" - the watch presumably made it clear to Zhao Yunlan that Lin Jing was involved, even , before Lin Jing enters the room.) - I don't think I ever before realised quite so clearly that while Kong Jing struggles with his alternate personalities and tries to kill himself, while Chu Shuzhi tries to save him by holding his hand with a string, Shen Wei simply stands there watching. And Zhao Yunlan (untied but still in handcuffs) sits on his chair, also watching. Neither of them move to interfere. I wonder what they're thinking in this moment.
- I love that he manages to drop a lollipop before Kong Jing knocks him out!
- Ye Zun in the Pillar:
- We discover that Wang Xiangyang has now used the Merit Brush 30 times, drawing a symbol in Dragon City and weakening the energy seal that holds Ye Zun. They need three more - but there's already a noticeable effect, as Wu Tian'en discovers in Dixing when it turns out Ye Zun can now attack people from the Pillar.
- We also get a look at Ye Zun's manipulation methods as he tries to get into Wu Tian'en's head via his son, who is suffering in prison. Wu Tian'en insists they did wrong first, so it's not anyone else's fault. Ye Zun then talks about Lao-Wu's team that went to Haixing back in the day, and almost gets under his skin reminding him about how almost everyone died, but he still doesn't succeed. An attack of black energy hits him in the end, and I honestly can't remember if we hear more about this later ...
- A random assortment of details:
- SID detail: Zhao Yunlan says they have nowhere to put the taxi driver and sends him back to the Inspectorate (where he then promptly escapes from prison). So the SID doesn't have any cells - not that that comes as a surprise at this point, given that we'd surely have seen it during Zhu Jiu's captivity, but it's good to have canon confirmation.
- Zhao Yunlan: "Why did you buy so much food?" *immediately plops himself down and grabs two skewers*
- When Zhu Hong attends Shen Wei's class, she says she wants to narrow the gap between "his" mind and hers. (No need to say whose! *g*) I really want to know how she thinks attending a random bioengineering class will do that ...
- Doctor-patient confidentiality doesn't seem to exist in Dragon City: Dr Cheng, unprompted, gives Zhao Yunlan a whole bunch of details about Kong Jing's diagnosis and history. (Everyone including Zhao Yunlan thinks Kong Jing is acting.)
- I think this is the first clear sign Minister Gao is in over his head: he sounds entirely at the end of his rope when he's shouting into the phone about the bank robbery, and only pulls himself together to sound like an authority figure when he notices Zhao Xinci coming in. Love that Zhao Xinci congratulates him on having become "more fluent in officialese" (LOL) since he's become minister!
(Incidentally, this implies either that Minister Gao hasn't been Minister for very long, or that he and Zhao Xinci haven't interacted much since he did, or perhaps both. (It could be that they're only interacting more again since Zhao Xinci's promotion to head of the Xingdu Bureau.) - Zhao Xinci and Zhang Shi: When Zhao Xinci stands up to leave, he's suddenly in pain, and when he straightens again, his smile is very much Zhang Shi's. It's subtle, but there, and Minister Gao draws attention to it when he wonders why Zhao Xinci suddenly called him by his given name. In the context of this episode, this might be a red herring about Zhao Xinci having caught the personality change as well, even though we've already seen Zhang Shi come forward in other circumstances.
- When Shen Wei is about to leave for Dixing, Zhao Yunlan playacts a changed campy personality:
ZYL: *grabs Shen Wei's arm* Hei Pao-gege, take care! I'll wait for you. *leans in*
SW: *pushes his head away with his palm* Cut it out. Anyone but you is susceptible to this. *leaves*
ZYL: *shakes his finger after him* You're no fun.
For that last line (here quoted fromsolo's subs), I want to share some background from fandoestrans (source, even though now I can't see it any more, since I don't have an account): so I just realized that in this scene ZYL says 真没情趣 which was translated as "you have no taste" but 情趣 is also what adult shops are called, 情趣店 (qing qu dian), in Chinese
情趣 = emotional/sexual interest, generally meaning spice, appeal etc
I think the meaning if the whole sentence would probably be closer to "you really have no interest in intimacy"
Or perhaps "you have no interest in spicing things up? :D
(I mean, there's good reasongalaxysoup's delightful episode guide describes this scene as "Shen Wei is uninterested in roleplay"!) - Zhao Yunlan shouting at Minister Gao: he's completely out of line in talking to a superior, but he's also clearly at the end of his rope, and Minister Gao takes it in stride, calls him Xiao-Zhao, pats his back and tells him not to be impatient. He could be far worse as a boss.
- Dixing and the Regent: the Regent laments the state of Dixing ("People have left, people have died. Popular feeling is unstable. These years, Dijun Palace has become more empty and hollow."), and Shen Wei looks up at An Bai behind the screen. Lovely little moment. - Interestingly, the Regent is actually semi-helpful here, responding to Shen Wei's query about personality-changing powers and advising him (correctly) to find the source of the contagion. Perhaps it's because it has nothing to do with the Regent's own machinations for once? *g*
- Perhaps the best line of the episode is spoken by Lin Jing: "Boss, are you eager for the whole team to be annihilated, so you and Professor Shen can have the world to yourselves? Rest assured, I don't take up much space. I won't bother you two. Just treat me as air." :D
(No, I lie. The actual best line of the episode is "You're mistaken. I'm not awake yet." *g*) - The second interrogation of Zhu Hao: flashback of the taxi driver almost hit Bai Suxia! And of Zhu Hao's escape from the Haixing Inspectorate, being carried on someone's back. I want to look a bit more at one part of this scene, which I kept stumbling over, so I want to clarify:
Zhao Yunlan: "You just said that man looked familiar." (There is no such line in the dialogue, but presumably Zhu Hao said that while we watched the flashback. *g*)
Zhu Hao: "I think he was my passenger before. Before I committed the crime." (The subs have this as "before the accident", which kept confusing me, but I'm pretty sure he's actually talking about the incident where he attacked someone with a bottle!)
Zhao Yunlan shows him a pic of Kong Jing in his hospital bed on his phone (why does he have this?!), and the taxi driver flinches back and says it's him.
Guo Changcheng: "What happened between you two before the crime?"
(The original subs confusingly had this as "before the accident";solo just has it as "back then". But he's also referring to the taxi driver's violent outbreak.)
(And then, before Zhu Hao can say any more, a feather dart comes in through the fan in the wall - wow, some aim! - and hits him in the neck, immediately killing him.) - I really love that Ya Qing kills Kong Jing in the end, giving him the release he wants, even though it's against her side's interests. This episode shows off some of her better qualities - she's still willing to kill and cause all the destruction Ye Zun wants, but she still has her own code of honour, which doesn't involve robbing someone of their last shred of dignity. And which does involve gratitude to an enemy who was kind to a dying Crow girl: ""This is a token of trust from our tribe. Take it. Take some time to think, and then you may ask a favour from me. There aren't many things I can't accomplish."
(Of course Xiao-Guo immediately asks her to stop helping Ye Zun and being everyone's enemy! And she's angry, but decides to let it go under the circumstances. This scene says so much about both of them!) - This is also the episode where we discover - and Zhao Yunlan begins to realise - that there's something shifty going on with Lin Jing, culminating in him uncharacteristically helping process the crime scene and attempting (but not succeeding) at hiding the evidence of the syringe he finds there, which of course leads back to the lab at the Ministry, and the serum they're working on. I do wonder just how much Lin Jing knows about what's going on there - he caught on right away when Shen Wei said Kong Jing was an ordinary person, but does he know about the missing/stolen syringe, or does he think Kong Jing is related to Professor Ouyang's experiments? Hmmm ...
- Zhao Yunlan: "You said that all personality changes are rooted in one's own weaknesses. So if a person is the same before and after the infection, does that mean he's honourable, righteous, brave, and has no weaknesses?"
Dr Cheng: "If after a personality change people are unable to tell the difference, then it could be that ordinarily, that person is already using some form of disguise."
I think when Zhao Yunlan initially asks, he's asking about both Lin Jing and himself, and mocking himself a bit to make light of a question that matters to him: why he wasn't affected, and what that says about him. And then, when the answer hits home, his focus shifts to Lin Jing. - Another bit of foreshadowing continues with the thread of Guo Changcheng's visits to various graves. We see him at Kong Jing's grave; from Dong Nan, we hear he's previously brought yoghurt for Grandma Li, noodle cups for Lai Su, and chocolate for Zu Ma.
Dong Nan: "You and the people who passed, what relationship do you have with them?"
An excellent build-up to Guo Changcheng's future serum-induced power - it's clearly rooted in his personality and traits that have been on display, so the form it takes fits him very well.
Discussion starters:
- What do you think of the personality changes? Can you watch this episode without wincing? (Do you watch it through your fingers? *g*)
- What's your favourite scene, and your favourite line?
(Zhao Yunlan as Kong Jing's captive is my favourite scene, and I already mentioned my favourite line above: "You're mistaken. I'm not awake yet." :D) - What's Minister Gao's actual job? What does the Haixing Inspectorate do? In this episode, he's apparently responsible for dealing with a crime wave, and Zhu Hao is held at the Inspectorate ...
- During the conversation between Minister Gao and Zhao Xinci, why does Zhang Shi take over when he does? (I don't think it can be because he wants to say/do anything in particular.) And is the pain Zhao Xinci experiences because Zhang Shi is taking over, or conversely, is Zhang Shi taking over because he can manage the pain/Zhao Xinci's health better than Zhao Xinci?
- "Anyone but you is susceptible", says Shen Wei. Why is he convinced Zhao Yunlan is immune to the personality change? Why is Zhao Yunlan immune? Do you think there's an external reason?
My theory is that Dr Cheng is correct, and Zhao Yunlan is immune not because of any special powers (whether due to his position as Guardian or due to the energy exchange with Shen Wei, or other or protection from Shen Wei), but because of how in control of his image Zhao Yunlan is. And of course Shen Wei knows this about Zhao Yunlan. But the question remains: how does he know this confers immunity to the personality-changing effect? Could it be because the same self-awareness is what makes some people immune to Ye Zun's mind control powers? Thoughts? - Why does the taxi driver return to normal before Kong Jing dies? Everyone else only reverts afterwards, but Zhu Hao is back to his usual self when he's captured again.
- When Kong Jing comes at Zhao Yunlan with black energy between his hands, it takes several moments, but then Kong Jing is suddenly thrown back, and Zhao Yunlan discovers black energy around his hands. He whispers, "Hei-laoge," and the energy dissipates. What exactly is going on here? I assume Zhao Yunlan is correct in ascribing the protective black energy effect to Shen Wei - but how? Is this perhaps the counterpart to the white energy Shen Wei gained from the energy exchange with the Sundial? How does it work, and why is it actively protecting Zhao Yunlan?
- Dong Nan, on dying, transforms into a crow. Does this happen to all Yashou? (I feel like this would make more sense in the novel, where they're yao ...) Or is it perhaps a choice Dong Nan makes? Any theories?
- Where are Wang Zheng and Sang Zan during most of this? Is their disappearance from the episode because they were affected by the personality change, too? What would they be like, changed?
Let's talk about episode 25!
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Scene discussion:
Where GCC Is Not Feeling Like Himself by
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And personality change or no, Xiao-Guo has every right to be pissed off at people trying to read his diary, but perhaps Lao-Chu has permission? At any rate, he's read it before, and Xiao-Guo knows.
I assumed that was a "juniors don't really have an expectation of privacy" cultural thing, subverted because of the personality change. (But as always, I know nothing. :-) It's definitely part of the SID-as-family -- they're acting like intrusive older siblings.
Of course, then Guo Changcheng nearly starts a fight with Chu Shuzhi anyway, in response to Chu Shuzhi's usual behaviour.
That's so good! I love how taken aback Chu Shuzhi is to have his puppy snap at him. *g*
while Chu Shuzhi gets out of breath chasing someone, and can barely manage to hold on to one of his strings.
Yes, that's very weird. I wonder how much that's part of an obligatory pathologising of camp. If he were acting like this but still capable, it might not be acceptable to the censors? (More thoughts on camp to follow.)
Ahaha, yes. Awesome observation! *loves*
Shen Wei, meanwhile, is very "I'm staying out of this" about it all: Zhao Yunlan looks at him twice during this, and each time Shen Wei immediately turns away to look at his papers. He's brought the issue up to Zhao Yunlan before, but he clearly thinks Zhao Yunlan needs to deal with this on his own.
I love how unabashedly shippy this whole scene is. Like, the way Zhao Yunlan keeps looking at Shen Wei, like, can't you just publicly claim me and resolve it that way? *g* And Shen Wei silently being all, I warned you!
And he manages to be threatening with a feather duster!
The feather duster is a recurring motif from the video game! Why? Is it the same duster?? I have questions! *g*
I want to point out what he calls him in Chinese is his 知音 zhīyīn. See this post for an explanation of this and related terms.
Ooh, very cool. Thanks for the link!
Shen Wei kicks Kong Jing across the room. (Interestingly, he doesn't use black energy or anything, just a well-applied boot.)
But still kicks him hard enough that Lin Jing objects, saying, "Professor Shen, Master Shen, do you need to use so much force? If you kick him dead, wouldn't we have become criminals?" (Which, given Kong Jing is human, he has a point. The Envoy doesn't technically have jurisdiction here.)
I don't think I ever before realised quite so clearly that while Kong Jing struggles with his alternate personalities and tries to kill himself, while Chu Shuzhi tries to save him by holding his hand with a string, Shen Wei simply stands there watching. And Zhao Yunlan (untied but still in handcuffs) sits on his chair, also watching. Neither of them move to interfere.
*rewatches* Zhao Yunlan's legs are still zip-tied to the chair, too. I think Shen Wei is watching very closely and would have stepped in if Chu Shuzhi had lost control, but mostly he's standing guard over Zhao Yunlan. And Zhao Yunlan is leaving this to the people who haven't just been knocked out, tied up and terrorised. (I love how Lin Jing briefly reaches out as if to reinforce Chu Shuzhi's hold on the energy string, and then seems to think better of it. Hee!)
An attack of black energy hits him in the end, and I honestly can't remember if we hear more about this later ...
I can't remember, either. I know Wu Xiaojun is upset later that his dad is dead (or pretends to be?) -- is this when it happened? (I guess we'll find out.)
Zhao Yunlan: "Why did you buy so much food?" *immediately plops himself down and grabs two skewers*
LOL! I presume Da Qing bought the food with SID money, since he was ingratiating with the owner himself for info. So Zhao Yunlan has warring priorities? ;-)
When Zhu Hong attends Shen Wei's class, she says she wants to narrow the gap between "his" mind and hers. (No need to say whose! *g*) I really want to know how she thinks attending a random bioengineering class will do that ...
Oh, I thought she'd decided the way to Zhao Yunlan's heart was to be more like Shen Wei (and then latched onto an arbitrary part of Shen Wei's personality). *pets her* (In her defence, ZYL was interested in Shen Wei before the Envoy reveal, so his academic side is proven to have a draw. It would've been hilarious if she'd decided to try being more Envoy-y, though. *g*)
Incidentally, this implies either that Minister Gao hasn't been Minister for very long, or that he and Zhao Xinci haven't interacted much since he did, or perhaps both.
Ooh, good point. Minister Gao being relatively new to the job would make sense -- it would also fit with Zhao Yunlan only finding out in ep 14 that Minister Gao knows Zhao Xinci.
ZYL: *shakes his finger after him* You're no fun.
Ahhh, thank you so much for the links and explanation of this! *appreciates so much* <333 And haha, yes to the Galaxysoup quote. *g* (There's an implicit "Don't joke about our relationship!", isn't there?)
Zhao Yunlan shouting at Minister Gao: he's completely out of line in talking to a superior
SOOO out of line! I was really surprised he was being so emotional (maybe he was slightly affected by the personality switch after all? ;-p). If he'd had a manager more like Zhao Xinci, that would have got him in serious trouble, I think.
Perhaps the best line of the episode is spoken by Lin Jing: "Boss, are you eager for the whole team to be annihilated, so you and Professor Shen can have the world to yourselves? Rest assured, I don't take up much space. I won't bother you two. Just treat me as air." :D
It's so good! Shen Wei and ZYL aren't the least bit subtle about their relationship. *g*
(And then, before Zhu Hao can say any more, a feather dart comes in through the fan in the wall - wow, some aim! - and hits him in the neck, immediately killing him.)
TwoThree things about this:a) I don't understand why Ya Qing killed him here. It's not like he has tons of info he can tell the SID -- he's already spilled the salient points. Is she doing it for Wang Xiangyang, as part of his revenge rampage? Why now?
b) It really bothers me that someone dies in SID custody, and they don't seem to feel responsible for failing to keep him safe. I know events overtake them, but I'd at least like a "block off that vent!" comment. ;-p
c) None of them seem to feel endangered, either -- either here or at Kong Jing's place. How do they know they're not next in line for a crow dart?
I really love that Ya Qing kills Kong Jing in the end, giving him the release he wants
Yeeeeah, I guess they've shown that the medical establishment can't help him... I would've liked to see Shen Wei try, though. Just because Kong Jing wanted to die in that moment, didn't mean he had to, you know? Maybe there were healers in Dixing who could have tried to help, or Snake herbalists... Though again, part of WXY's revenge-apalooza.
Of course Xiao-Guo immediately asks her to stop helping Ye Zun and being everyone's enemy! And she's angry, but decides to let it go under the circumstances. This scene says so much about both of them!
And about how little anyone understands her agenda, I think? Like, the SID view her as one of Ye Zun's henchpeople, rather than a political player with her own goals.
but does he know about the missing/stolen syringe, or does he think Kong Jing is related to Professor Ouyang's experiments?
I think he knows. I think Professor Ouyang asked him to find the syringe, and as soon as the SID found out Kong Jing was human, he figured it out, and that's why he's looking around so carefully.
I think when Zhao Yunlan initially asks, he's asking about both Lin Jing and himself, and mocking himself a bit to make light of a question that matters to him: why he wasn't affected, and what that says about him. And then, when the answer hits home, his focus shifts to Lin Jing.
We've talked about this before. I continue to think he's only talking about Lin Jing. I think that's why he's holding the watch Lin Jing gave him, and he looks at it after the phone call. If he was wondering about himself, wouldn't he be asking Shen Wei, who confidently stated ZYL couldn't be affected? (But we don't have to agree on this. :-)
What do you think of the personality changes? Can you watch this episode without wincing?
I enjoy grumpy aggressive Changcheng very much -- it's a delightful contrast to his usual kind sunny nature. I feel sorry for Lao Chu, who would definitely never have chosen it -- I mean, none of them would, but it's so revealing particularly for Lao Chu who's usually all locked down, and I think Shen Wei's right that he'd hate it. I enjoy Zhu Hong's shift both for what
My favourite scene is every time Zhao Yunlan can't cope, lol. His entire management style is manipulating people based on knowing them well, and now they're not conforming to his models of them -- it's a nightmare! :D :D :D
What's Minister Gao's actual job?
Good question! I'd say he's in charge of public services or something, including law enforcement, but that wouldn't explain his authority over the lab. So I'm really not sure.
is Zhang Shi taking over because he can manage the pain/Zhao Xinci's health better than Zhao Xinci?
I think it must be that. He doesn't deliver any pointed Zhang Shi-specific message, just tells Minister Gao to take care.
"Anyone but you is susceptible", says Shen Wei. Why is he convinced Zhao Yunlan is immune to the personality change? Why is Zhao Yunlan immune? Do you think there's an external reason?
I think it's like mind control, ie, strength of mind is a defence, with perhaps additional protection from the Guardian Treaty (I'm more and more persuaded by this! ;-p). During the video game, Zhao Yunlan talked about how the rest of the SID need to train their mental defences -- he's clearly confident in his own.
Maybe his were tested/trained by the DoS before his appointment to the role
after the previous SID chief was turned into an iguana?I do feel like the SID could have done some thinking about how the personality changes are spreading, and put safety measures into place, but I guess it all happened so fast...
Dong Nan, on dying, transforms into a crow. Does this happen to all Yashou?
It doesn't happen to Da Ji or Zhu Hong's Snake friend. Maybe it's a kid thing?
More notes to follow.
no subject
I have a different read on that exchange -- or maybe an additional read? I think it's deliberately and fairly subtly ambiguous, so as to slide past the censors. Reading 1 is that camp is shameful, unacceptable, pathological, gross -- that's the surface reading. Reading 2 is that aggressively having his emotions all over the place makes Chu Shuzhi professionally inappropriate and hard to manage (from Zhao Yunlan's POV) and would be extremely humiliating to Chu Shuzhi personally (from Shen Wei's). And that Chu Shuzhi pretty much coming onto Zhao Yunlan is kind of gross, given the three of their relationships.
Supporting reading 2 is the fact that Zhao Yunlan immediately jokes around being camp himself. If he really thought it was gross, would he have done that? Would he have been (mildly) disgruntled that Shen Wei refused to play along? And Shen Wei doesn't say, "Eww!" at Zhao Yunlan's act -- he essentially implies, as I said above, "Don't joke about our relationship." Because aside from anything else, ZYL not being real is one of his big DNWs.
And I mean, if Shen Wei had delivered a very macho Chu Shuzhi to the SID who was equally aggressively having emotions all over the place, would it have been fair to expect the SID to take him in? It's not professional or manageable. So I think reading 2 works, as well, and is deliberate.
The third instance of camp / men being effeminate in the episode is Kong Jing's female alter, who comes on to Zhao Yunlan, making Zhao Yunlan recoil. Again, I think you can read ZYL's reaction in two ways: a) that camp is gross in and of itself, or b) that Zhao Yunlan is tied up and genuinely at risk of sexual assault if things escalate. Again, I think the double reading is deliberate; showing a man acting like a woman has to be pathologised to get past the censors.
And both times, it's a kind of "no homo" that lets them lean into the Shen Wei/Zhao Yunlan ship a little harder, because according to reading 1, Zhao Yunlan has demonstrated he's not into that stuff. When he plays with it himself, he's just (according to reading 1) mocking Chu Shuzhi.
/trying to get my thoughts in order; not sure if I succeeded?
Some notes from my watch:
Min. Gao: Xiao Zhao. Set aside some time to visit your father.
ZYL: What's wrong with him?
Min. Gao: He's getting older. He needs his family to be there for him.
ZYL: Rest assured, I will.
Is this setting up Zhao Yunlan finding Zhao Xinci meeting with Shen Wei? Did Zhao Xinci deliberately plan that, maybe to drive a wedge between Zhao Yunlan and Shen Wei? *waits to see if there are more hints*
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Yeah, I agree with all of that, including that reading 2 is deliberately there - and Zhao Yunlan's joking definitely supports it! But I hate the surface reading so much, it being there (which it undeniably is) makes it unpalatable to me no matter what else is beneath it.
Interesting that, once it becomes clear this is spreading, Shen Wei doesn't try to heal people (that we see).
Oh, good point! He doesn't even examine them. I wonder why ...
Interesting that Zhao Yunlan doesn't suggest accompanying Shen Wei to Dixing this time. Too much else to do?
He's the only currently functional member of the SID; I don't think he thinks he can absent himself.
Is this setting up Zhao Yunlan finding Zhao Xinci meeting with Shen Wei? Did Zhao Xinci deliberately plan that, maybe to drive a wedge between Zhao Yunlan and Shen Wei? *waits to see if there are more hints*
Huh, I'm not sure how that would work? Zhao Yunlan doesn't see Shen Wei and Zhao Xinci together because of anything Zhao Xinci does; I don't think Zhao Xinci could have counted on that ...
Chu Shuzhi gives the cop a pep talk, which interestingly, the taxi driver doesn't seem to find cringey or react to at all. And Zhao Yunlan resists intervening; it's unnaturally aggressive Changcheng who violently threatens Chu Shuzhi with a file (ie, the show isn't condoning that reaction?).
Yeah, very interesting! Zhao Yunlan does send Chu Shuzhi out of the room, though. I took that as disapproval as well; how did you take it?
He mentions the SID, and I think we're supposed to think he's targeting Zhao Yunlan. Red herring!
Oooh, yes, good catch!
And ha, he's so much more comfortable with tough guy Kong Jing -- which, fair enough. He knows how to deal with tough guys.
He manages to handle both the tough guy and the suicidal guy well enough; it's only the campy/feminine version he can't deal with. From an in-universe perspective, presumably that means he's unused to it, so he has no experience with how to react.
What does "You guys are early" mean? Just that he's still alive, mostly unhurt?
Shen Wei says he's late; Zhao Yunlan saying he's early is just refuting the implied self-criticism, I think? And saying everything worked out fine, nothing to worry about.
The hallway between the flats. Shen Wei turns to his own apartment? Really? Don't you live with Zhao Yunlan by now? Maybe he's just going to change into casual hanging-out-on-the-couch-wear... ;-p
I mean, presumably he keeps his clothes and his books and his papers at his own place; Zhao Yunlan's flat doesn't have the space. So, yeah, my vote is for him going to change! *g*
Btw, I added an additional question to the post last night, which I forgot about earlier: Where are Wang Zheng and Sang Zan during most of this? Is their disappearance from the episode because they were affected by the personality change, too? What would they be like, changed? Any thoughts?
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Yeah, that's entirely fair, and it bothers me too. I just tend to attribute it to outside forces, I suppose, and be glad the show mitigated it as well (and delightfully) as they could.
He's the only currently functional member of the SID; I don't think he thinks he can absent himself.
LOL! Good point.
Huh, I'm not sure how that would work? Zhao Yunlan doesn't see Shen Wei and Zhao Xinci together because of anything Zhao Xinci does; I don't think Zhao Xinci could have counted on that ...
I thought Zhao Yunlan and Zhao Xinci could have arranged to meet at the tea shop, and then when Shen Wei contacted Zhao Xinci to discuss diplomatic matters, ZXC could have named the same location, 15 minutes earlier, or something. (I always wonder where exactly Zhao Yunlan is going when he spots them -- this theory would make sense of that? Anyway, we can talk about it when we get to that ep.)
Zhao Yunlan does send Chu Shuzhi out of the room, though. I took that as disapproval as well; how did you take it?
A reaction to Chu Shuzhi derailing the interview? Like, disapproval of his interview technique rather than, necessarily, his manner? Idk.
He manages to handle both the tough guy and the suicidal guy well enough; it's only the campy/feminine version he can't deal with. From an in-universe perspective, presumably that means he's unused to it, so he has no experience with how to react.
I think it's at least partly because the female alter is unpredictable and poring over a table of torture implements, and Zhao Yunlan has just woken up and is still getting his bearings. And then she comes on to him, and it's creepy as anything, so it's a relief when a different alter comes out... /o\
Zhao Yunlan saying he's early is just refuting the implied self-criticism, I think?
I just think of that as "on time", not "early". ;-p /quibbly, sorry
Where are Wang Zheng and Sang Zan during most of this? Is their disappearance from the episode because they were affected by the personality change, too? What would they be like, changed?
Oh, I really don't know. Maybe they were up in the library fighting and hurling books at each other the whole time. /o\
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A reaction to Chu Shuzhi derailing the interview? Like, disapproval of his interview technique rather than, necessarily, his manner? Idk.
I guess that works!
I think it's at least partly because the female alter is unpredictable and poring over a table of torture implements
Haha, yeah, the torture implements definitely don't help! So so creepy.
Maybe they were up in the library fighting and hurling books at each other the whole time. /o\
Ouch! :(
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Yeah, agreed - but even personality-changed, Lao-Chu touching it doesn't set him off.
I love how taken aback Chu Shuzhi is to have his puppy snap at him. *g*
Haha, that's a great way to put it!
Yes, that's very weird. I wonder how much that's part of an obligatory pathologising of camp.
Yeah, that's entirely possible!
I love how unabashedly shippy this whole scene is. Like, the way Zhao Yunlan keeps looking at Shen Wei, like, can't you just publicly claim me and resolve it that way? *g* And Shen Wei silently being all, I warned you!
Right? It's so great! I love that there's never any question that Zhao Yunlan and Shen Wei belong together. They know it; everyone knows it (see also Lin Jing's delightful line). Zhu Hong just isn't a rival at all, and that's honestly the best way to deal with it.
*rewatches* Zhao Yunlan's legs are still zip-tied to the chair, too.
Oh, are they? Interesting that Shen Wei doesn't move to free him, then, just stands there and watches, and never once moves to interfere.
I love how Lin Jing briefly reaches out as if to reinforce Chu Shuzhi's hold on the energy string, and then seems to think better of it. Hee!
Such a great moment!
I know Wu Xiaojun is upset later that his dad is dead (or pretends to be?) -- is this when it happened?
No, that's a few episodes later, IIRC - he survives this, at least.
Oh, I thought she'd decided the way to Zhao Yunlan's heart was to be more like Shen Wei
Sure! But even if she decides that being into bioengineering specifically is somehow an important part of why Zhao Yunlan likes him, attending a random lecture will not help her understand anything!
Incidentally, this implies either that Minister Gao hasn't been Minister for very long, or that he and Zhao Xinci haven't interacted much since he did, or perhaps both.
Minister Gao being relatively new to the job would make sense -- it would also fit with Zhao Yunlan only finding out in ep 14 that Minister Gao knows Zhao Xinci.
Also an excellent point!
ZYL: *shakes his finger after him* You're no fun.
(There's an implicit "Don't joke about our relationship!", isn't there?)
Yes, I figure that's a big part of why Shen Wei is so irritated with him!
I don't understand why Ya Qing killed him here. It's not like he has tons of info he can tell the SID -- he's already spilled the salient points. Is she doing it for Wang Xiangyang, as part of his revenge rampage? Why now?
Honestly, I'm not sure either.
And that's a good point, too, about no one feeling either responsible for Zhu Hao's death in custody, or apparently in danger by the flying death darts! The episode glosses over that so well, I never even noticed. *g*
Yeeeeah, I guess they've shown that the medical establishment can't help him... I would've liked to see Shen Wei try, though. Just because Kong Jing wanted to die in that moment, didn't mean he had to, you know?
I agree! When I said I love it I didn't mean I think him dying is best for him, I meant I love how it shows how Ya Qing thinks. And she 100% thinks of it as mercy.
And about how little anyone understands her agenda, I think? Like, the SID view her as one of Ye Zun's henchpeople, rather than a political player with her own goals.
Yeah, no one apart from her Crows really understands her! No wonder she's frustrated, but she might have tried, you know, talking to people first?
(Okay, to be fair, she did talk to Ying Chun; Ying Chun not getting it is definitely not all Ya Qing's fault. *g*)
I think Professor Ouyang asked him to find the syringe, and as soon as the SID found out Kong Jing was human, he figured it out, and that's why he's looking around so carefully.
Yeah, he definitely knew the serum was involved the moment he heard Kong Jing was human. And it would make sense for Professor Ouyang to ask him to help find the thing!
We've talked about this before. I continue to think he's only talking about Lin Jing.
Yeah, and I still can't read the way he asks as anything other than mocking himself. *g* I think he's asking about both Lin Jing and himself, but not expecting it to be a big deal - one person being unaffected is weirder than two, you know? He probably just expects to hear something like, yeah, some percentage of people are immune, or whatever. (Given all the science nonsense in this episode, that wouldn't even be out there! :p)
My favourite scene is every time Zhao Yunlan can't cope, lol.
Haha! It's so hard for him, yeah. No one is acting like they should! How is he supposed to work with that?!
I think it's like mind control, ie, strength of mind is a defence, with perhaps additional protection from the Guardian Treaty (I'm more and more persuaded by this! ;-p). During the video game, Zhao Yunlan talked about how the rest of the SID need to train their mental defences -- he's clearly confident in his own.
The mind control bit rings true to me, and good thought about his mental defences perhaps being tested before he was appointed chief!
(I continue to be unconvinced by speculation about the role of Lord Guardian conveying any kind of powers or protection; the drama just doesn't give me that vibe at all.)
It doesn't happen to Da Ji or Zhu Hong's Snake friend. Maybe it's a kid thing?
You could turn that around and say it's a sign they're not actually dead - but then you'd think everyone else would notice!
Yeah, maybe a kid thing, or maybe just Dong Nan's preference.
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True, good point. Lao Chu gets a pass until he starts discussing it with the rest of the team.
I love that there's never any question that Zhao Yunlan and Shen Wei belong together. They know it; everyone knows it (see also Lin Jing's delightful line). Zhu Hong just isn't a rival at all, and that's honestly the best way to deal with it.
And Zhu Hong knows it, too, but she can't let go of hope because Zhao Yunlan won't even acknowledge her feelings.
Interesting that Shen Wei doesn't move to free him, then, just stands there and watches, and never once moves to interfere.
Maybe he feels that interfering would making Chu Shuzhi even more humiliated later on. So he just stands guard over Zhao Yunlan and watches carefully to see if he's needed.
Sure! But even if she decides that being into bioengineering specifically is somehow an important part of why Zhao Yunlan likes him, attending a random lecture will not help her understand anything!
She'll get to see Shen Wei in action? But yeah, definitely not thinking rationally at this point. *pets her*
When I said I love it I didn't mean I think him dying is best for him, I meant I love how it shows how Ya Qing thinks. And she 100% thinks of it as mercy.
*nodnod* That makes sense!
No wonder she's frustrated, but she might have tried, you know, talking to people first?
Do you think she didn't, before the show started? Maybe she tried but no one would take her seriously -- either the threat posed to the Yashou by human expansion or the lengths she considered necessary to counter that threat?
(I continue to be unconvinced by speculation about the role of Lord Guardian conveying any kind of powers or protection; the drama just doesn't give me that vibe at all.)
The Guardian Token constrains Shen Wei's powers in Haixing. I don't see why it shouldn't have other effects, too? Otherwise, what's the point of the Lord of the Guardians title? (I actually prefer Zhao Yunlan completely unpowered, but I feel like a subtle protection would make a certain amount of sense, and maybe play into Zhao Yunlan's over-confidence...)
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Oh, yeah, I could see that! At least after Chu Shuzhi gets involved, that's a good reason for Shen Wei to not step in.
Do you think she didn't, before the show started? Maybe she tried but no one would take her seriously -- either the threat posed to the Yashou by human expansion or the lengths she considered necessary to counter that threat?
She must have talked to people, but she definitely didn't talk to the Envoy, or the current SID. She assumed she already knew they'd be hostile to her intentions, because they're upholding the Treaty and she's decided the Treaty is the problem. I wonder how she developed that opinion.
(I mean, she's not entirely wrong about that, either!)
The Guardian Token constrains Shen Wei's powers in Haixing. I don't see why it shouldn't have other effects, too?
Yeah, no, it's not that it couldn't - it's entirely possible, from a worldbuilding perspective. It's just not at all what I'm getting from canon, and I feel like if we were to assume he got any kind of boost from the position it would have been mentioned somewhere. Agree to disagree? *g*
(Yeah, I also prefer Zhao Yunlan completely unpowered. *g*)
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Do you think so? I feel like there needed to be a separate treaty between humans and Yashou, and either they initially didn't see a need for it because the Yashou decided to retreat back to their own territory, so it never existed, or it did exist but got lost. I'm not sure how the Guardian Treaty with Dixing relates?
Yeah, agree to disagree. :-)
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This is close to my take as well, except part of the treaty does seem to include Yashou.
Episode 13:
Ying Chun: "According to the original agreement we can't interfere their internal conflict. Only then they won't bother us in return."
Ya Qing: "Following the old rules there won't be opportunities for Yashou revivification."
So my interpretation is that there's a general non-interference clause in the treaty, but no other stipulations (such as the Envoy's position, or the fact that Haixingren are required to hand Dixingren criminals over to Dixing), because Fu You's intention to retreat meant they didn't foresee a need for that. (And perhaps also because the treaty between Dixing and Haixing was re-negotiated at some point? At any rate, the human government recognises Dixing as a separate polity with separate territory, but it doesn't recognise the Yashou in the same way.)
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I don’t really buy the explanation for Lin Jing/possibly Zhao Yunlan not being affected.
It seems like it’s made out to be a binary: Either your personality swaps 180° or nothing happens. But people are not divided into unapologetically themselves and putting up a front, it’s a sliding scale; and where you fall on it has at least as much to do with the situation you’re in than who you are intrinsically.
Most people have a professional persona for work, for example. If that persona is sufficiently fake, could someone be unaffected by the swap, but only while clocked in at work?
The explanation raises more questions than it answers imo.
What's your favourite scene, and your favourite line?
My favourite part of this episode is the fact that while everyone is increasingly off the rails, Shen Wei remains totally impassive. Just stone-faced in the background.
Dong Nan, on dying, transforms into a crow. Does this happen to all Yashou? (I feel like this would make more sense in the novel, where they're yao ...) Or is it perhaps a choice Dong Nan makes? Any theories?
I believe this implies that the animal shape is a Yashou’s “true” form, which is in line with Da Qing being very much a cat always.
Where are Wang Zheng and Sang Zan during most of this? Is their disappearance from the episode because they were affected by the personality change, too? What would they be like, changed?
The personality change is transmitted via physical touch, right? Can
ghostsenergy beings be touched in such a way?Would have been very useful to have more people around who are immune...
And I also love that then his fast-talking promptly gets Zhao Yunlan into trouble
Yes! Love that his strength is also his weakness.
I really want to know how she thinks attending a random bioengineering class will do that ...
Right?? Even for a student of bioengineering, joining a class in the middle of the semester would be difficult. And why this subject? It’s not like Zhao Yunlan is a bioengineer. And if she wants to compete with Shen Wei, maybe don’t pick a field where he’s literally an expert?
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It doesn't make sense in real-world terms, but I think this is one of the places where you just have to suspend your disbelief and go along with the fake "science".
My favourite part of this episode is the fact that while everyone is increasingly off the rails, Shen Wei remains totally impassive. Just stone-faced in the background.
Hee! You're right, that is great. :D
(And all the more impressive given how much the actors were cracking up!)
I believe this implies that the animal shape is a Yashou’s “true” form, which is in line with Da Qing being very much a cat always.
But yeah, it happening with Dong Nan does imply that their animal side is their "real" self in some sense. I wonder if it's becaue she's younger, or if she makes a choice about it.
The personality change is transmitted via physical touch, right? Can ghosts energy beings be touched in such a way?
Would have been very useful to have more people around who are immune...
Guardian's energy ghosts definitely can be touched, and we even see them eat. I guess they must have been affected, or they'd have been around to help out - but I have no clear image of what that might look like for these two.
Yes! Love that his strength is also his weakness.
RIGHT???? :D
Right?? Even for a student of bioengineering, joining a class in the middle of the semester would be difficult.
This! That was exactly my reaction, LOL. She presumably wants to be as like Shen Wei as possible, because that's what Zhao Yunlan is into? But this is not a great strategy!
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Yeah, at some point we have to just roll with it.
china_shop pointed out that neither the Snake guy Ya Qing (presumably) kills nor Da Ji change on dying, and if that were a clear sign that they're alive, surely the other Yashou would know?
But yeah, it happening with Dong Nan does imply that their animal side is their "real" self in some sense. I wonder if it's becaue she's younger, or if she makes a choice about it.
Hm, that introduces a contradiction to that theory, for sure.
The time between Xiao Guo going oh no she’s dead and her transforming is so small, it’s impossible to tell if changing forms was still her own doing. It didn’t read to me like it was – I can’t really back this up, though, it’s just how the scene felt to me.
I guess they must have been affected, or they'd have been around to help out - but I have no clear image of what that might look like for these two.
Do you think them not showing IS the personality change? Like, they became suddenly unwilling to help?
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Yeah, same here, honestly.
Do you think them not showing IS the personality change? Like, they became suddenly unwilling to help?
That would be interesting! They were also absent-without-explanation when Zhu Jiu and Zheng Yi invaded the SID, though, so maybe they're leading a secret double life somewhere. :p
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Me too. I do think we're supposed to read it that way.
Maybe it's to do with what proportion of their lives they spend in either form -- ie, Dong Nan grew up largely as a Crow and only spent a small amount of time in human form, so she reverted to Crow at death, whereas Da Ji had been running around on two legs a lot and stayed that way when she died? /random theory
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True! And I think you could easily argue that Zhao Yunlan is a little affected: he shouts at Minister Gao! And it's not like Lin Jing isn't being real with the SID at the same time as spying on them. Yeah.
My favourite part of this episode is the fact that while everyone is increasingly off the rails, Shen Wei remains totally impassive. Just stone-faced in the background.
LOLOL! Such a good point. That's awesome!