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sid_guardian2022-06-17 10:26 pm
Scene Discussion: Episode 2x2
I hope everyone enjoys!
Here is the nitty-gritty for each episode:
First Scene: From the 30:56 mark to the 31:18 mark
Second Scene: From 33:30 mark to the 33:05 mark
Screen captures sourced from the awesome: Guardian Episode 2 Caps 2 - Kernezelda (smugmug.com) 😊
And translations from Solo’s guardian vids 😊
Scene 1:
We start with Zhao Yunlan stepping closer to the ‘newly’ arrived Hei Pao Shi, after he’s put the other Dixingren down flat on the ground.
Zhao Yunlan: Old Bro Black. You really came in time.
At this point Hei Pao Shi turns around to face Zhao Yunlan. When he first turns his eyes don’t meet Zhao Yunlan’s, it’s only after a moment that he finally lifts his gaze upward. (I find his expression here interesting here. Almost like reluctance or possibly hesitation? Perhaps a I want to look, but I don’t because my heart can’t take it.)
We then have a moment where the camera is focused on Zhao Yunlan. (His expression reads as intensely curious to my brain) Then it’s back to Hei Pao Shi. 
When Hei Pao Shi speaks, he looks down and says: I was careless again and arrived late.
The camera angle transitions to a long shot showing both ZYL and HPS. (I really love how it’s angled in the below shot, it’s very catchy to the eye-or at least my eye!!)
Hei Pao Shi continues to speak: Forgive me.
Zhao Yunlan says: No. No. No. I don’t deserve this.
Then Zhao Yunlan proceeds to say: All right, take him away from here. I can’t settle this. (I’m still reading HPS’ expression here as tentative or fragile, something!! I cannot find the right words tonight XD)
At this point HPS steps away and back over to the other Dixingren, all the while as Zhao Yunlan watches him.
/End
Scene 2:
<b>CW:</b> Death of a beloved family member/grief/cemeteries.
Professor Shen and the SID Team are at the cemetery to support Li Qian. Eventually, Zhao Yunlan steps away to lean against a nearby tree, and not long after Shen Wei follows. As the Professor arrives Zhao Yunlan unwraps a lollipop the he had pulled from his jacket pocket.
When Shen Wei arrives ZYL looks up and SW gives a small smile before it transitions into a long shot. (I know I’ve said it before but they’ve really set up some lovely lovely shots throughout this whole show). In the background you can see the rest of the SID crew that came along still surround LQ.
Shen Wei gazes at the group whereas Zhao Yunlan stays focused on the lollipop. Finally, as the camera focuses over Shen Wei’s shoulder, Shen Wei begins to speak: Since Li Qian’s grandmother’s funeral (the camera shifts to SW’s face) the Dixing person hasn’t appeared again. (Zhao Yunlan’s expression is very somber and said – rightly so in this situation – but having watched the whole series it makes me think he’s thinking about his mom and such.)
The shot changes again to show a more full body angle of the two and Zhao Yunlan looks away, saying as he does: Guo Changcheng, that blabbermouth. Why is he telling you everything? (Did he though? LOL. Or is it because SW IS HPS XD XD. But poor GCC getting the blame for it all.)
It shifts back to Shen Wei who says: I really want to know why these people choose this time to reappear.
At this, Zhao Yunlan (who was looking off into the distance) turns his attention back to Shen Wei.
When Zhao Yunlan speaks, the camera angel turns back to looking over Shen Wei’s shoulder. (To note, before ZYL speaks he stares at SW for a hot few seconds, then looks away, and takes a moment to take the lollipop out of his mouth. My brain interrupted this as ZYL considering just how much to say to Shen Wei.>
Zhao Yunlan says: I think there’s a problem somewhere as well.
Scene 1 Thoughts/Questions:
- At the end of the scene either the music makes it sound like a crow is cawing, or they added the sound effect in there, or I’m crazy, but my ears hear a crow caw of some sort!!! Which if it is a crow caw, I think is possibly a precursor to Ya Qing showing up? (I can’t recall what episode she showed up, so I could totally be wrong!)
- How does everyone read Zhao Yunlan and Hei Pao Shi’s expressions in the first few minutes of their conversation? I definitely read ZYL as SUPER curious. Like: let me watch everything he does, because I want to know MOAR about this cloaked man whereas HPS’ look is much tentative. I still don’t know what word I really want to use. Pining-ish? Or possibly uncertain/scared, or a combination of them. My brain interprets it as ‘I cannot look, but I have to look, but I cannot because <b>reasons</b>’ and that’s the best way I can summarize it LOL.
- What thoughts do you think are going through Shen Wei’s head? I am super curious what people think he’s thinking (along with how to read his expression!!)
Scene 2 Thoughts/Questions:
- What thoughts do you think both Shen Wei and Zhao Yunlan are having as they tiptoe around the elephant in the room? The elephant being: SW is HPS and KNOWS things and ZYL isn’t quite sure who SW is and how much he can possibly trust him.
- An interesting thing to note in this scene is there’s absolutely no background music, which I think brings another level of seriousness to it. All you can hear is the typical background noises one might hear, like birds chirping, etc.
- I think it’s very interesting to see Zhao Yunlan’s expression stay rock solid somber – which is obviously warranted! – but it likewise lends an air of sadness to it all.
- Finally, do you think Shen Wei doesn’t know what/who is causing the problem and playing dumb to see what Zhao Yunlan and SID know, or does he perhaps not realize (at this point) who’s stirring the pot?
Thank you for taking the time to read this and I look forward to people’s points and discussions on these two clips from the second episode :D
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Thank you for reading and commenting!!
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I think in the first scene, Shen Wei is
a) trying to gauge if Zhao Yunlan's "You came in good time" is sincere or sarcastic and prickly like he was on the rooftop the first time. (This is only the second time they've met as Chief and Envoy, right?) As the Envoy, Shen Wei is conciliatory here, but also formal and dignified, I think? And Zhao Yunlan isn't being very polite, with his telling the Envoy what to do, but he's not hostile anymore either, so that's a step forward.
b) trying not to have his identity found out, so doing what he can to avoid Zhao Yunlan's scrutiny, without being obvious about it.
I agree Zhao Yunlan is curious -- and maybe assessing, too? Observing how the Envoy reacts to his tone, determining if they can work together, intrigued by his power?
In the second scene:
My brain interrupted this as ZYL considering just how much to say to Shen Wei.
Oh, yes, I definitely think that's part of it. I don't know if Zhao Yunlan suspects Shen Wei at this point, but he does know something strange is up with him. Plus he's a civilian, and Zhao Yunlan thinks SID work should be done by the professionals.
An interesting thing to note in this scene is there’s absolutely no background music, which I think brings another level of seriousness to it.
Excellent point, yes! And to me it feels like a serious moment between equals, even though they still know so little about each other.
I think it’s very interesting to see Zhao Yunlan’s expression stay rock solid somber
Ooh, yes. That's unusual for him -- but as you say, apt for the context. I wonder if as well as respect and sympathy towards Li Qian, it's because graveyards make him think of losing his mother? (Sorry if you said that already; it's late here and my brain is shutting down.)
Finally, do you think Shen Wei doesn’t know what/who is causing the problem and playing dumb to see what Zhao Yunlan and SID know, or does he perhaps not realize (at this point) who’s stirring the pot?
I feel like Shen Wei is deliberately sticking his nose into SID business, partly to guide Zhao Yunlan towards the right conclusion (that he should be on guard because things might be heating up) and partly to put himself in Zhao Yunlan's sights (because Zhao Yunlan/Kunlun!). He must know that there's a possibility Ye Zun is behind things, but it's very early days, and I doubt he'd leap to that conclusion without more evidence. (At this stage, I don't think he knows about Zhu Jiu, does he?)
Thanks again for such a great, thoughtful post! <3
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(This is only the second time they've met as Chief and Envoy, right?) - Yes, I believe this was only the second time they had met XD XD
As the Envoy, Shen Wei is conciliatory here, but also formal and dignified, I think? And Zhao Yunlan isn't being very polite, with his telling the Envoy what to do, but he's not hostile anymore either, so that's a step forward. - Agreed that there is a definite formality here with HPS talking to ZYL. I also imagine the formality was/is used as a way for Shen Wei to erect a wall between himself and others. Much like how he used his mask. So that people would see something other than what was there (not that he was necessarily 'scared' here like when he used to go into battle, but hopefully I'm making sense!). I agree ZYL is no longer hostile here!!
I agree Zhao Yunlan is curious -- and maybe assessing, too? Observing how the Envoy reacts to his tone, determining if they can work together, intrigued by his power? - Yes, definitely assessing too! I agree. I like the thought of ZYL trying to determine if they can work together. You have to wonder what his father told him about HPS, because I don't think that was ever addressed much in the show.
I feel like Shen Wei is deliberately sticking his nose into SID business, partly to guide Zhao Yunlan towards the right conclusion (that he should be on guard because things might be heating up) and partly to put himself in Zhao Yunlan's sights (because Zhao Yunlan/Kunlun!). He must know that there's a possibility Ye Zun is behind things, but it's very early days, and I doubt he'd leap to that conclusion without more evidence. (At this stage, I don't think he knows about Zhu Jiu, does he?) - Agree agree! Also, I am having feelings now about thinking how SW is probably like: Let me just be in his presence. As for Zhu Jiu, I agree I don't think he realizes he's causing the problems at this point either. Just that problems are steadily increasing!
Thank you for taking the time to read and comment! I appreciate it!! :D
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*nodnod* I think the formality is part of the role and part of Shen Wei's compartmentalising, for himself as well as for others. Does that make sense? (I feel like the 'scared to go into battle' probably only really referred to early on, when he was a new soldier; by the time he told Kunlun about it, it was just to explain why he started wearing the mask, not something that was still true? I mean, he was a general by then. But that's just my reading of it. :-)
Yes, definitely assessing too! I agree. I like the thought of ZYL trying to determine if they can work together.
And then in the next scene, ZYL summons the Envoy to the SID to talk about the Hallows, so he must have decided that building a good working relationship is a viable option. <3 <3 <3
You have to wonder what his father told him about HPS, because I don't think that was ever addressed much in the show.
Yess, that would have been so fascinating to find out -- how much did ZYL know about the Envoy beforehand, and where did he learn it from??
Also, I am having feelings now about thinking how SW is probably like: Let me just be in his presence.
Right? He must be having So Many Emotions, after all this time! (And then ZYL shows up at the university in the next episode and sneezes on his fishtank, and SW tells him off for interrupting his work, lol.)
♥ ♥ ♥
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That's how I see it too!
I feel like the 'scared to go into battle' probably only really referred to early on, when he was a new soldier; by the time he told Kunlun about it, it was just to explain why he started wearing the mask, not something that was still true?
And this as well! *g*
And then in the next scene, ZYL summons the Envoy to the SID to talk about the Hallows, so he must have decided that building a good working relationship is a viable option.
He still needs Da Qing to prompt him first; he's not the one who brings it up. But he does decide to try, yeah!
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Yess, that would have been so fascinating to find out -- how much did ZYL know about the Envoy beforehand, and where did he learn it from?? - I know!! I agree with this completely. He could probably have even heard rumors and gossip about the 'fearsome Hei Pao Shi'. That would be interesting to explore in a fic!
Right? He must be having So Many Emotions, after all this time! (And then ZYL shows up at the university in the next episode and sneezes on his fishtank, and SW tells him off for interrupting his work, lol.) - THAT SNEEZING!! LOL. And GCC in the background like: I'm just here to take notes XD XD (I think GCC was there) But either way those two! I love all their interactions XD
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And GCC in the background like: I'm just here to take notes XD XD (I think GCC was there)
Ahaha, yes, I think you're right. Poor GCC, trying to be a good intern around his IMPOSSIBLE boss. :D :D :D
(I hope work stops chomping on you soon! *hugs*)
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That's a very good point! And ZYL is still not exactly polite, but not as outright rude as he was on the rooftop, yeah.
I feel like Shen Wei is deliberately sticking his nose into SID business, partly to guide Zhao Yunlan towards the right conclusion (that he should be on guard because things might be heating up) and partly to put himself in Zhao Yunlan's sights (because Zhao Yunlan/Kunlun!).
Yes, all this, 100%! :D
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I wonder how much the difference is just from, from ZYL's POV, a) showing up on the rooftop after Chu Shuzhi has already (apparently quite easily) subdued the shadow man, and ZYL just had to sit around and make clever quips, versus b) Gao Tianyu attacking at the hospital, hurting Xiao Guo and getting away, then having a run-in with Chu Shuzhi and getting away, and then literally pulling Li Qian from the car with his powers. Maybe with a), the Envoy's arrival and intervention felt a little OTT compared to the effort the SID had to put in, but with b) the situation is clearly far of ZYL's ability to handle it, the Sundial is unpredictable and doesn't give ZYL an exit strategy, and Lao Chu isn't even there to help. ??
IOW, perhaps it took this encounter for ZYL to recognise the value of having the Envoy show up to deal with arrestees? (And his "not exactly polite" might be related to the Envoy's complete failure to show at the hospital?)
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And his "not exactly polite" might be related to the Envoy's complete failure to show at the hospital?
Maybe, though if the Envoy just turned up everywhere immediately, they wouldn't need a SID to begin with. And I don't think ZYL, especially at this point in time, would be comfortable leaving it all to a Dixing representative acting on his own in Haixing ...
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Also, the SID isn't just for arresting -- it's for investigating, as well.
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Yes, and they don't want the Envoy to take that over too. But without investigating on his own, how can the Envoy always know where to appear? (He clearly doesn't. I think what brings him in this time is the Sundial being activated?)
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Btw, this:
how can the Envoy always know where to appear?
makes me wonder if that's part of Shen Wei's motivation for cosying up to the SID. Keeping tabs on cases, knowing when things are likely to go down... ?
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I find his expression here interesting here. Almost like reluctance or possibly hesitation? Perhaps a I want to look, but I don’t because my heart can’t take it
I think he's not sure how to handle this version of Kunlun just yet. And also maybe worried about ZYL recognising him? Very cautious.
His expression reads as intensely curious to my brain
It seems very "what is up with this guy, he doesn't fit his reputation" to me, but at the same time ZYL is very brisk about telling the Envoy to take the attacker away. Much like on the rooftop, I donÄt think he wants the Envoy’s involvement even though he knows they need it – he doesn't like not being in control. (Later this episode, he has to be prompted by Da Qing to smoke-call the Envoy and ask him about the Sundial. There's some hesitancy to overcome!) But at the same time he is curious, as you say! There is a draw.
Zhao Yunlan’s expression is very somber and said – rightly so in this situation – but having watched the whole series it makes me think he’s thinking about his mom and such
Yeah, agreed. I think the graveyard gets under his skin.
Did he though? LOL. Or is it because SW IS HPS XD XD. But poor GCC getting the blame for it all.
Hee! Poor GCC indeed. *g*
ZYL considering just how much to say to Shen Wei
Yeah, and wondering what his angle is! Why is this random professor inserting himself into SID business and Dixing stuff? But unlike with the Envoy, he's more willing to engage with Shen Wei. He hesitates, but then he does agree with Shen Wei that something fishy is going on with these Dixingren turning up now. He's drawn to Shen Wei, and he’s not pulling away (much). Because he feels more in control, I think, and because he can tell himself he’s just investigating someone suspicious. *g*
At the end of the scene either the music makes it sound like a crow is cawing, or they added the sound effect in there, or I’m crazy, but my ears hear a crow caw of some sort!!!
I'm not hearing it – what's the time stamp?
Which if it is a crow caw, I think is possibly a precursor to Ya Qing showing up?
It wouldn’t surprise me! Shen Wei does say at one point he's figured out Ya Qing's involvement because there have been crows at various crime scenes. There’s definitely one at the webnovelist's place, for example.
(Ya Qing's first appearance isn’t until episode 13! Wow, so late, I keep forgetting that.)
I think it’s very interesting to see Zhao Yunlan’s expression stay rock solid somber – which is obviously warranted! – but it likewise lends an air of sadness to it all.
Yeah, you're right, that is very striking, especially this early on when most of what we've seen of ZYL wasn’t like this!
Finally, do you think Shen Wei doesn’t know what/who is causing the problem and playing dumb to see what Zhao Yunlan and SID know, or does he perhaps not realize (at this point) who’s stirring the pot?
I think he doesn't yet know who's behind it. IIRC t takes him a while to find Zhu Jiu, and then to figure out there has to be someone behind him. I don't think he really knows, this early on, how organised it all is and how much more there's behind this attempt on the Sundial ...
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Ohh, that control thing is a really good point. This is his turf/jurisdiction, and maybe he's a little bit defensive about being in authority (given his father's opinion of him, etc)? Hmm...
Later this episode, he has to be prompted by Da Qing to smoke-call the Envoy and ask him about the Sundial. There's some hesitancy to overcome!
Yeah, absolutely, but he does overcome it. There's enough trust to invite the Envoy into the heart of the SID.
He's drawn to Shen Wei, and he’s not pulling away (much). Because he feels more in control, I think, and because he can tell himself he’s just investigating someone suspicious. *g*
Ha, yes. This. It's so interesting comparing these two moments, and his different reactions to the Envoy vs the professor! :D
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Yeah, that makes sense to me!
There's enough trust to invite the Envoy into the heart of the SID.
Agreed. He's just being slow to speak to the Envoy, compared to his willingness to speak to Professor Shen. The Envoy has way more reason to be involved, but ZYL is way more hesitant about him. For all kinds of reasons, both personal and political. As you say, it's really fascinating to compare these moments!
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It seems very "what is up with this guy, he doesn't fit his reputation" to me, but at the same time ZYL is very brisk about telling the Envoy to take the attacker away. Much like on the rooftop, I donÄt think he wants the Envoy’s involvement even though he knows they need it – he doesn't like not being in control. (Later this episode, he has to be prompted by Da Qing to smoke-call the Envoy and ask him about the Sundial. There's some hesitancy to overcome!) But at the same time he is curious, as you say! There is a draw. - I forgot that it was Da Qing you nudged Zhao Yunlan to call Hei Pao Shi. Definitely reluctance by ZYL in calling for HPS!! And yes, I noticed too that Zhao Yunlan was very quick and brisk to tell HPS to take the Dixingren away.
I'm not hearing it – what's the time stamp? - I will find time stamp and send it over once work has stopped chomping on me.
I think he doesn't yet know who's behind it. IIRC t takes him a while to find Zhu Jiu, and then to figure out there has to be someone behind him. I don't think he really knows, this early on, how organised it all is and how much more there's behind this attempt on the Sundial ... - I agree. I don't think he realizes that the movement isn't just random people wanting to cause trouble, or a better life, or just one-shot 'villains' of the week sort of thing.
THank you so much for reading and commenting!! I appreciate it!! :D
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To me, he reads like he's bracing himself to keep his expression under control, to not give away the pining and yearning filling his being? Sort of like, time to be professional now, duty first emotions later. Which imo whenever he's staring at ZYL doesn't always work, but he's doing his best xD
Agree that ZYL is definitely curious! I forget if this is the next time after the rooftop they meet? Because that one ended a bit ominous, it would make sense for ZYL to be tentative (which. I *do* think he's careful and prodding to see where the boundaries fall with the Envoy because there was so much going on in the rooftop scene, from ZYL chastising HPS for not showing up before to him calling him Old Bro Black/Hei-laoge and not being admonished for it, but having the Envoy respond with Zhao-xiong instead. They're still establishing their dynamic, and I don't think it's anything like ZYL expected)
I do love the back and forth of the whole. Thanks for showing up, apology, deferral. It's a very Chinese thing and I wish I had a firmer grasp on the culture to see what reads as sarcastic, genuine, and just polite respectively. It feels multi-layered to me and I wanna peel it like an onion *g*
Eventually, Zhao Yunlan steps away to lean against a nearby tree, and not long after Shen Wei follows. As the Professor arrives Zhao Yunlan unwraps a lollipop the he had pulled from his jacket pocket.
Imo, this is one of the more smoking-reminiscent scenes, it's very smoker-like to step away so as not to bother people with the smoke, plus ZYL's posture and everything, nevermind the stress-smoking in such an emotionally tense place and circumstance <.< (sad thoughts about mom for sure!) The wide-shot especially where ZYL sticks the lollipop in looks *very* much like smoking to me.
It shifts back to Shen Wei who says: I really want to know why these people choose this time to reappear.
I wonder, because ZYL has to suspect Shen Wei of being Dixingren already at this point, if he's thinking 'reappear, just like you suddenly appeared?' and if he's wondering if this is Shen Wei trying to be subtle about telling ZYL why he's in Haixing? (I mean, as audience we know that Shen Wei is trying to prepare ZYL for what's to come, and possibly still trying to figure out himself what the new surge of Dixingren attacks means. Does he already suspect Ye Zun is behind it? With one of the Hallows appearing again... I feel like he has to have suspicions at least, but I don't think he's confirmed it yet? He chases Zhu Jiu in episode 3 for the first time, I think, which is probably chasing down leads of the mastermind, and then he needs to make the connection from Zhu Jiu to Ye Zun...)
I think it’s very interesting to see Zhao Yunlan’s expression stay rock solid somber – which is obviously warranted! – but it likewise lends an air of sadness to it all.
Huh. This is... niggling at me in a way I haven't quite finished thinking through. Like, ZYL often is very performative and cheeky/inappropriate as a mask for his real motivations/feelings, right? The fact that he's showing the somberness here instead of deflecting, that's. a first sign of vulnerability? Still cautious and I think that's also in his expression, a sort of guardedness. A test, like, "you're suspicious but I want to like you. Can I trust you to see me not being flirty/happy/smirky?" While also, both of them being serious in this is like the first steps into a partnership, they're still dancing around it but they *are* discussing the issue. I'm not sure where I'm going with this tho sorry 😂
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To me, he reads like he's bracing himself to keep his expression under control, to not give away the pining and yearning filling his being? - YES! I really like this thought so much.
Agree that ZYL is definitely curious! I forget if this is the next time after the rooftop they meet? Because that one ended a bit ominous, it would make sense for ZYL to be tentative (which. I *do* think he's careful and prodding to see where the boundaries fall with the Envoy because there was so much going on in the rooftop scene, from ZYL chastising HPS for not showing up before to him calling him Old Bro Black/Hei-laoge and not being admonished for it, but having the Envoy respond with Zhao-xiong instead. They're still establishing their dynamic, and I don't think it's anything like ZYL expected) - I believe this is their next interaction since the rooftop scene, yes! And yes, agree that he's testing the boundaries to see what can/can't be said/done. Definitely get that impression that they're trying to feel out their dynamic.
Imo, this is one of the more smoking-reminiscent scenes, it's very smoker-like to step away so as not to bother people with the smoke, plus ZYL's posture and everything, nevermind the stress-smoking in such an emotionally tense place and circumstance <.< (sad thoughts about mom for sure!) The wide-shot especially where ZYL sticks the lollipop in looks *very* much like smoking to me. - YES. I didn't even think of that, but it such the whole 'let me step away to smoke' vibe feeling. Yessss.
Huh. This is... niggling at me in a way I haven't quite finished thinking through. Like, ZYL often is very performative and cheeky/inappropriate as a mask for his real motivations/feelings, right? The fact that he's showing the somberness here instead of deflecting, that's. a first sign of vulnerability? Still cautious and I think that's also in his expression, a sort of guardedness. A test, like, "you're suspicious but I want to like you. Can I trust you to see me not being flirty/happy/smirky?" While also, both of them being serious in this is like the first steps into a partnership, they're still dancing around it but they *are* discussing the issue. I'm not sure where I'm going with this tho sorry - It definitely gives a very push-pull sort of feel, the two of them going back and forth. Each dancing around the words of what to say and what to reveal, all the while knowing they each have their own sekrets to protect, but also wanting that connection to take place, or hopeful that it can take place if that makes sense!!
AHH, thank you again for reading and commenting :D I love seeing everyone's thoughts on these scenes, it always opens up different ways to see things :D
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It definitely gives a very push-pull sort of feel, the two of them going back and forth. Each dancing around the words of what to say and what to reveal, all the while knowing they each have their own sekrets to protect, but also wanting that connection to take place, or hopeful that it can take place if that makes sense!!
It does! It's a give and take which is pretty common for relationships of any sorts, and they're carefully toeing along the lines to see how much trust can be given/is earned, while it's still too early to reveal too much. And between the breadth of secrets Shen Wei is keeping and Zhao Yunlan's distrust/suspicion, it's a very interesting dance. Especially because imo Zhao Yunlan *wants* to trust Shen Wei (he's attractive! and way out of his league but clearly cares! but why??? it makes no sense! how can ZYL trust this is legit and not some trap, especially with how suspicious Shen Wei behaves??) but the secrecy and suspicion aren't making it easy.
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Oh, that's a really good point! You're right, that makes perfect sense, that is what it looks like!
Like, ZYL often is very performative and cheeky/inappropriate as a mask for his real motivations/feelings, right? The fact that he's showing the somberness here instead of deflecting, that's. a first sign of vulnerability?
Yeah, a sign that he's capable of being/willing to be more genuine as well, sometimes, not just flippant at all costs. And now that you're saying it, this early on, Shen Wei is probably a bit relieved to see it. *g*
A test, like, "you're suspicious but I want to like you. Can I trust you to see me not being flirty/happy/smirky?"
That makes a lot of sense to me!
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Oh, that's true. Good point!
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I think it's actually the other way round: the Envoy starts with Zhao-xiong, and ZYL leapfrogs right past him and uses Hei-laoge. :D :D :D
I do love the back and forth of the whole. Thanks for showing up, apology, deferral. It's a very Chinese thing and I wish I had a firmer grasp on the culture to see what reads as sarcastic, genuine, and just polite respectively. It feels multi-layered to me and I wanna peel it like an onion *g*
I think the form of it is standard etiquette, but his delivery is pretty rude? I mean, he starts out with "did you forget the way?" /o\ *g* (I love how he navigates the political waters so expertly, even/especially when he's being less than welcoming. ♥)
But yesss, agreed, I love how multilayered it is, all the undercurrents from both sides, which the show gradually explains. IT'S SO GOOD!!
Imo, this is one of the more smoking-reminiscent scenes, it's very smoker-like to step away so as not to bother people with the smoke, plus ZYL's posture and everything, nevermind the stress-smoking in such an emotionally tense place and circumstance <.< (sad thoughts about mom for sure!) The wide-shot especially where ZYL sticks the lollipop in looks *very* much like smoking to me.
Ahh, that's such a good point! I love that (and now you've identified it, I think it's part of what I find attractive about it *koff*). I wonder if he kind of forgot for a moment that he's quit. *pets him*
I wonder, because ZYL has to suspect Shen Wei of being Dixingren already at this point, if he's thinking 'reappear, just like you suddenly appeared?'
Hm, except Shen Wei hasn't just suddenly appeared. He's been at the university for ten years... I'm not sure ZYL would have leapt to suspecting him of being Dixingren yet, either. So far, his experience of Dixingren have been light years from this respectable, controlled professor. (I think you could argue it either way, is what I'm saying.)
Like, ZYL often is very performative and cheeky/inappropriate as a mask for his real motivations/feelings, right? The fact that he's showing the somberness here instead of deflecting, that's. a first sign of vulnerability?
Or just context-appropriate behaviour? It would be pretty strange for him to start his performance here during a funeral, I think? Idk. (I feel like there are other times he turns it on and off with Shen Wei, like when cases get serious; it's not a constant. But ymmv. :-)
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*facepalms* right, I don't know how I didn't notice. I think the youtube subs had him translated as saying Chief Zhao and that just stuck in my brain? :')
(I love how he navigates the political waters so expertly, even/especially when he's being less than welcoming. ♥)
It's one of his strengths! :D I wish it was explored more in fic (or maybe I just haven't found the right fics yet lmao I'm always down for my babies being badass at navigating the system to their advantage)
Ahh, that's such a good point! I love that (and now you've identified it, I think it's part of what I find attractive about it *koff*). I wonder if he kind of forgot for a moment that he's quit. *pets him*
It's a very hot but casual lean against the tree! *thumbs up* (oh man, I could totally buy it, ZYL being so out of sorts and needing to reorient himself thus breaking away from the group and groping for a smoke but coming up with a lollipop instead... ó.ò)
Hm, except Shen Wei hasn't just suddenly appeared. He's been at the university for ten years... I'm not sure ZYL would have leapt to suspecting him of being Dixingren yet, either. So far, his experience of Dixingren have been light years from this respectable, controlled professor.
but he has suddenly stuck his nose in SID's business just as things are starting! very suspicious :D and idk I could see ZYL formenting the Dixingren theory in the back of his mind, after the fall from the roof without a scratch. Except for the ones left by the shadow man's claws, but it's not like he sees those :') plus Shen Wei argues a lot in favour of Dixingren pretty early on, but I forget which episodes those happen at exactly, they're sprinkled in there... hm. I don't think he's feeling like it's /confirmed/ yet, but he does make some impressively intuitive leaps. OTOH you're right, ZYL here is still stuck in his prejudice and only slowly prodding those assumptions, so Professor Shen's austensible respectibility would be a counterargument for that theory.
Or just context-appropriate behaviour?
Valid point! I was mostly hung up that this is the first time in Shen Wei's presence that he's turned it off (I think we would've seen it on the rooftop if SID arrived to Professor Shen trying to fight off the Shadow Man, but that's not what happened so. ZYL arrived late to the hospital fight, and Shen Wei was "stuck" in the car during the post-car confrontation, so there weren't a lot of contexts yet necessiting ZYL to be 100% serious.
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... this is making me wonder how much he took up smoking as an excuse to retreat at times. Some people smoke as a social activity, but I could see it going either way with ZYL, at the start. *pets him*
but he has suddenly stuck his nose in SID's business just as things are starting!
Yes, he's very much an interested party. He knows far too much to be entirely innocent. But he could be protecting someone or just have a scholarly interest. (I presume the surface excuse for consulting him on cases is that he's knowledgeable about Dixing in a scholarly way? Oh, maybe that's yet another reason for Shen Wei refusing to work for them officially: he won't confirm he's from Dixing, and he doesn't want to work for ZYL under false pretences, however nominal? There are lots of other, stronger reasons, but I can see that weighing in, maybe?)
after the fall from the roof without a scratch
He got lucky, and the bushes broke his fall, I don't know what you mean! *whistles with slightly desperate "innocence"* :D
and Shen Wei was "stuck" in the car during the post-car confrontation
Oh! This made me go back and watch the car scene (pre-attack). ZYL is pretty serious/subdued there? And there's also the bit where the two of them saved Li Qian from jumping off the biology building... So I don't think this is the first time. Maybe the first time he could have flirted and didn't, though. But again, funeral.
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Hmmm, I could see it being both? I don't know how "rebellious" smoking is in China, but that could be a factor, too. (Alternatively, wanting to appear more grown-up?) Starts with social drinking and smoking (since bars are major smoking areas in China, iirc?), and then gives him a neat excuse to step out in other situations.
Yes, he's very much an interested party. He knows far too much to be entirely innocent. But he could be protecting someone or just have a scholarly interest.
I'm not saying it's the only theory! :D In my head, ZYL always has multiple theories going that he's crossing off as the likelihood sinks until he arrives at the most likely conclusion two steps ahead of others.
I do wonder though, because Dixing is supposed to be not well-known, right? Kinda a secret? ZYL was surprised Shen Wei knew anything. On the other hand, his research pre-supposes the existence of mutants of some form... (if he were working for Professor Ouyang, he'd have a legit excuse, but tbf he's not interested in that. Besides, conflict of interests much huh?) I'm not sure how clear canon is re: how much an invested someone could learn about Dixingren, like Cong Bo only learned because he caught cam footage of Shen Wei using his powers, and he's a snoop and was looking into the SID. Which would suggest it's pretty well under wraps? But on the other hand... ngggh I don't know.
Oh! This made me go back and watch the car scene (pre-attack). ZYL is pretty serious/subdued there?
Oh, fair! that was a somber scene indeed. (but yeah, funerals. Not a great place to try new pick-up lines)
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Or it started as a "reason" to sneak out of his dad's house, when he was still living at home. Like, desperately needing to get out, but not quite admitting that to himself, so taking up secret smoking so he could lie to himself that he wasn't desperate to escape, he was handling things fine? Idk. /random :-)
Anyway, however he started, I'm sure it became a thing he used both for socialising and for getting space, as needed.
I'm not saying it's the only theory! :D In my head, ZYL always has multiple theories going that he's crossing off as the likelihood sinks until he arrives at the most likely conclusion two steps ahead of others.
*nodnod* That's fair. I guess I'm just questioning it because in ep 4 we see him starting to put the pieces together (at which point Shen Wei promptly decides to give himself a minor injury and not heal it). Which suggests ZYL hadn't figured it out sooner, I think.
I do wonder though, because Dixing is supposed to be not well-known, right? Kinda a secret? ZYL was surprised Shen Wei knew anything.
He was (and also that he was speaking of them so openly, and in their defence, I think?). Counter-evidence (seen in previous discussions on this subject which I can't find right now) include: Teacher Zhang wasn't shocked or surprised by Wang Yike's abilities, Dr Cheng has a Dixingren younger brother, there are other Dixingren living in Haixing, and occasional attacks. There must be rumours. And the science community seems to know more than most other people -- which ZYL might know about through Lin Jing.
(but yeah, funerals. Not a great place to try new pick-up lines)
Hee! Depends on the funeral, but yeah.
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That seems like a very Zhao Yunlan thing to do indeed :'D
I guess I'm just questioning it because in ep 4 we see him starting to put the pieces together (at which point Shen Wei promptly decides to give himself a minor injury and not heal it). Which suggests ZYL hadn't figured it out sooner, I think.
Fair point! I'm not sure what my personal opinion is quite yet, I will keep an eye on that during my rewatch <3 Right now, I could be sold on it either way
Counter-evidence (seen in previous discussions on this subject which I can't find right now) include: Teacher Zhang wasn't shocked or surprised by Wang Yike's abilities, Dr Cheng has a Dixingren younger brother, there are other Dixingren living in Haixing, and occasional attacks. There must be rumours. And the science community seems to know more than most other people -- which ZYL might know about through Lin Jing.
The existence of Dixingren and how secret it is kept is a headache to me, I definitely want to dig into that worldbuilding *adds it to list of Rewatch Notes* alongside with What Do We Know Of The Treaty. From my first impression watching Guardian last year, it felt like they were contradicting and retconning things later in the show, but that might just be misinterpreting the set-up one way and that not panning out. Same with: are Dixingren allowed topside, it feels like there's several contradictory cases (like you said, Dr Cheng's younger brother is obviously Dixingren, why didn't the SID know about him before? On the other hand, we were supposed to buy that ZXC shot Sha Ya's boyfriend without provocation, even if they twisted that into a 'misunderstanding' later. Mirror girl didn't hurt anyone, but was taken in for judgment... it's confusing lol)
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Free real estate? :-) I think it probably just means it's not uniform. Some people know, some people suspect Weird Things Are Afoot, some people are friends with Dixingren and know to keep it on the DL, and most people have no idea about anything. Meanwhile, the DoS hushes things up as much as possible, to avoid mass panic. That seems pretty plausible to me?
like you said, Dr Cheng's younger brother is obviously Dixingren, why didn't the SID know about him before? On the other hand, we were supposed to buy that ZXC shot Sha Ya's boyfriend without provocation, even if they twisted that into a 'misunderstanding' later. Mirror girl didn't hurt anyone, but was taken in for judgment... it's confusing lol
Dixingren aren't officially allowed topside, as far as Haixing is concerned. I don't think ZYL's SID consider it their job to proactively go and round up or take note of every Dixingren in Dragon City, though, even if they could. They're called out when there are cases. Presumably Zu Ma (Dr Cheng's brother) hadn't caused any trouble before the video game case, so the SID wouldn't have been aware of his existence.
Mirror Girl was taken away because she threatened to blow up her boyfriend and the SID, after her boyfriend failed to recognise her and called her a monster. And as a direct result of that case, the SID and the Envoy explicitly agreed that people should only be deported if they've broken the law (which was technically a change of policy for the SID, I think, but which I feel like ZYL was pretty comfortable with by then).
ZXC made his name as a hardline anti-Dixingren SID chief, which means everyone's willing to think the worst of him. And, to be fair, he is pretty bad a lot of the time. ;-p
/how I see it :-)
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I don't think ZYL's SID consider it their job to proactively go and round up or take note of every Dixingren in Dragon City, though, even if they could. They're called out when there are cases. Presumably Zu Ma (Dr Cheng's brother) hadn't caused any trouble before the video game case, so the SID wouldn't have been aware of his existence.
I agree with this in theory, but Zu Ma presumably has been a Medical Phenomenon for longer than Zhao Yunlan was Chief - if he's of a similar age as Cheng Xinyan, and their parents were looking into why he wasn't aging, then there should've been a stir during Zhao Xinci's tenure imo? Though I suppose they might've not been connected with medical professionals who heard about the Weird New Patient. I just can't see how something like that wouldn't make the papers at least ^^" It would be different if he weren't in a hospital bed but hidden away at home. (I'm fine ignoring it as a plot hole, I just can't bend it in a way that satisfies my sense of plausibility x'D)
Good point on Mirror Girl! (And I love love /love/ Zhao Yunlan's developement in the "Dixingren are people too" department always <3)
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Maybe they weren't? Maybe there's a semi-unspoken received wisdom in Dragon City that you keep your weirdnesses quiet and off the radar?
Or maybe the DoS discourages that kind of reporting in mainstream outlets, to avoid people asking too many questions and starting a panic? (That would explain why Cong Bo seems to be largely working online.)
And I love love /love/ Zhao Yunlan's developement in the "Dixingren are people too" department always <3
Yessss! The very best! <3 <3 <3