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sid_guardian2024-02-18 10:10 am
china_shop) wrote in sid_guardian2024-02-18 10:10 am
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Meta: Haixing bureaucrats Minister Gao and Director Zhao
I've been thinking about the contrasts between the ways Minister Gao and Director Zhao Xinci are portrayed, and what that says about a) their respective roles, and b) the show's values wrt bureaucracy.
Zhao Yunlan and Shen Wei's first meeting with Minister Gao, in ep 14. Shen Wei is sitting formally here, Minister Gao is pointing (rudely?), and Zhao Yunlan has his legs crossed and his hands clasped, keeping himself contained.
Same meeting, Minister Gao teasing them about the self-criticism.
Ot1h, we have Minister Gao Jingfeng, a pretty average suit who, once the crises start, turns out to have been promoted above his level of competence. Aside from our first introduction to him at the Huang/Li wedding, we mostly see him at the Department of Supervision, usually in his office. Apparently in charge of the city's operations(?), he's genial and chatty, sometimes stubborn but not particularly strong-minded. His attitude to Dixingren is equivocal -- he welcomes Shen Wei onto the SID team, and he describes Cong Bo as worse than a Dixing troublemaker.
Same meeting, but here, Minister Gao and Shen Wei are mirroring their body language. (I think Shen Wei leans forward first, shielding Zhao Yunlan from talk of Zhao Xinci by distracting Minister Gao.)
Ep 16, Zhao Xinci reading Xiao Guo's notebook and side-eyeing the SID team as they lie about how responsible Zhao Yunlan is.
Otoh, there's Director Zhao Xinci of the Xingdu Bureau. We never see him in his own office. Instead he has meetings all over the place -- in Minister Gao's office, in Zhao Yunlan's office, in a tea shop with the Envoy, at Zhao Yunlan's flat, and he's not at all adverse to field work when it's called for. He takes charge at the SID without missing a beat. He's decisive, autocratic, political, and opinionated -- including being strongly prejudiced against Dixingren -- and he expects to get his way without question, but he also has a fairly collegial relationship with Minister Gao, whom he outranks. He has blindspots (most notably his prejudice and his son), but he's generally strategic. He's also shown as moral in certain ways (insisting that Bai Suxia be treated before him at the hospital because he doesn't believe in queue-jumping), and he doesn't hold a grudge against Wang Xiangyang after being kidnapped and tortured. Once he's ditched Zhang Shi at the end, he's shown as lighter in temperament and more smiley.
Still ep 16. Zhao Xinci at Zhao Yunlan's desk at the SID, sitting back, legs crossed. Family traits?
Ep 16 again. Zhao Xinci bluffing by pulling the dark energy gun on Xiao Guo -- sort of like Zhao Yunlan later aiming the gun at Zhang Shi, though with much less justification.
Zhao Xinci has tea with the Envoy in ep 27. He's sitting back, legs crossed again; Shen Wei is sitting upright and formal.
Zhao Xinci sitting back with his legs crossed, in the "head of the table" seat, while Minister Gao sits formally with his hands on his knees. Ep 20.
The first time we see the two of them together, in episode 20, Zhao Xinci eschews any polite preliminaries and jumps straight into critiquing and high-handedly advising: "Lao Gao, not that I want to lecture you, but you are too muddled. You shouldn't discount Zhu Jiu as insignificant. He has been lurking in Dragon City for many years, he is unpredictable and has gotten involved in several serious cases. What Special Investigations are doing is a good thing, and an important thing as well. This responsibility, I'll bear it for him." Even though Zhao Xinci is partly driven by anti-Dixing bigotry, he's saying the right things here, I think? And his assessment of Minister Gao neatly foreshadows the minister's eventual downfall.
I feel like the show is more interested in Zhao Xinci than Gao Jingfeng; even while he's an antagonist, he's competent (his investigation methods aren't a hit with the SID, but they do pay off), and his drive to protect Haixing is understandable, even if his methods and attitudes to other species are clearly wrong. Meanwhile, Minister Gao's self-doubt and equivocating are shown as untenable weaknesses for a leader, and the show loses interest in him as soon as he's knocked unconscious and tied up.
Questions
Zhao Yunlan and Shen Wei's first meeting with Minister Gao, in ep 14. Shen Wei is sitting formally here, Minister Gao is pointing (rudely?), and Zhao Yunlan has his legs crossed and his hands clasped, keeping himself contained.
Same meeting, Minister Gao teasing them about the self-criticism.
Ot1h, we have Minister Gao Jingfeng, a pretty average suit who, once the crises start, turns out to have been promoted above his level of competence. Aside from our first introduction to him at the Huang/Li wedding, we mostly see him at the Department of Supervision, usually in his office. Apparently in charge of the city's operations(?), he's genial and chatty, sometimes stubborn but not particularly strong-minded. His attitude to Dixingren is equivocal -- he welcomes Shen Wei onto the SID team, and he describes Cong Bo as worse than a Dixing troublemaker.
Same meeting, but here, Minister Gao and Shen Wei are mirroring their body language. (I think Shen Wei leans forward first, shielding Zhao Yunlan from talk of Zhao Xinci by distracting Minister Gao.)
Ep 16, Zhao Xinci reading Xiao Guo's notebook and side-eyeing the SID team as they lie about how responsible Zhao Yunlan is.
Otoh, there's Director Zhao Xinci of the Xingdu Bureau. We never see him in his own office. Instead he has meetings all over the place -- in Minister Gao's office, in Zhao Yunlan's office, in a tea shop with the Envoy, at Zhao Yunlan's flat, and he's not at all adverse to field work when it's called for. He takes charge at the SID without missing a beat. He's decisive, autocratic, political, and opinionated -- including being strongly prejudiced against Dixingren -- and he expects to get his way without question, but he also has a fairly collegial relationship with Minister Gao, whom he outranks. He has blindspots (most notably his prejudice and his son), but he's generally strategic. He's also shown as moral in certain ways (insisting that Bai Suxia be treated before him at the hospital because he doesn't believe in queue-jumping), and he doesn't hold a grudge against Wang Xiangyang after being kidnapped and tortured. Once he's ditched Zhang Shi at the end, he's shown as lighter in temperament and more smiley.
Still ep 16. Zhao Xinci at Zhao Yunlan's desk at the SID, sitting back, legs crossed. Family traits?
Ep 16 again. Zhao Xinci bluffing by pulling the dark energy gun on Xiao Guo -- sort of like Zhao Yunlan later aiming the gun at Zhang Shi, though with much less justification.
Zhao Xinci has tea with the Envoy in ep 27. He's sitting back, legs crossed again; Shen Wei is sitting upright and formal.
Zhao Xinci sitting back with his legs crossed, in the "head of the table" seat, while Minister Gao sits formally with his hands on his knees. Ep 20.
The first time we see the two of them together, in episode 20, Zhao Xinci eschews any polite preliminaries and jumps straight into critiquing and high-handedly advising: "Lao Gao, not that I want to lecture you, but you are too muddled. You shouldn't discount Zhu Jiu as insignificant. He has been lurking in Dragon City for many years, he is unpredictable and has gotten involved in several serious cases. What Special Investigations are doing is a good thing, and an important thing as well. This responsibility, I'll bear it for him." Even though Zhao Xinci is partly driven by anti-Dixing bigotry, he's saying the right things here, I think? And his assessment of Minister Gao neatly foreshadows the minister's eventual downfall.
I feel like the show is more interested in Zhao Xinci than Gao Jingfeng; even while he's an antagonist, he's competent (his investigation methods aren't a hit with the SID, but they do pay off), and his drive to protect Haixing is understandable, even if his methods and attitudes to other species are clearly wrong. Meanwhile, Minister Gao's self-doubt and equivocating are shown as untenable weaknesses for a leader, and the show loses interest in him as soon as he's knocked unconscious and tied up.
Questions
- What do you think Minister Gao and Director Zhao's respective responsibilities are? I feel like the Department of Supervision is probably on-the-ground domestic operations, while the Xingdu Bureau is high-level policy and diplomacy, but I get thrown by their titles: a director outranking a minister. And who appoints the directors? I doubt Haixing is a democracy.
- How do you think the show presents Zhao Xinci and Gao Jingfeng as representatives of the state? What's the biggest contrast between them: autocracy, backbone, strategy, politics, something else?
- To what degree and in what ways do you think the show supports or condemns Zhao Xinci as a bureaucrat (as opposed to as a parent or a cop)?
- If Zhao Xinci had Gao Jingfeng's job, and was the minister in charge of the SID at the Department of Supervision, do you think he'd act any differently than he does in canon? I really can't tell how many of his actions are a product of his role, rather than his beliefs and personality.
- What do you think Zhao Xinci's office is like? Does he spend much time there?
- What about other bureaucrats in the show -- Vice Minister Guo, the university chancellor, the Regent, the Deacon? How do they compare and contrast? Who are foils for whom?
- Do you have any favourite fanworks dealing with Haixing or Dixing bureaucracy or politics?
- Fuck, Marry, Kill: Gao Jingfeng, Zhao Xinci, The Regent. (Sorry, sorry!! *g*)
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The government and politics of Haixing are still rather mysterious to me tbh. Not that Dixing is much better though… XD
Zhao Xinci eschews any polite preliminaries and jumps straight into critiquing and high-handedly advising: "Lao Gao, not that I want to lecture you, but you are too muddled
Love how brazenly he lies here. Oh no, this is totally not a lecture XD
I feel like the show is more interested in Zhao Xinci than Gao Jingfeng
That's absolutely true. It seems like a natural consequence of Zhao Xinci having an additional connection to a main character by being Zhao Yunlan’s father, while Gao has no other role than The Minister.
And who appoints the directors? I doubt Haixing is a democracy
Maybe something like Haixing’s equivalent of the CCP?
If Zhao Xinci had Gao Jingfeng's job, and was the minister in charge of the SID at the Department of Supervision, do you think he'd act any differently than he does in canon? I really can't tell how many of his actions are a product of his role, rather than his beliefs and personality.
I honestly don’t think it would be that different. My reasoning is that while Zhao Xinci is temporarily acting as SID chief, he doesn’t exactly change his ways either.
How do you think the show presents Zhao Xinci and Gao Jingfeng as representatives of the state? What's the biggest contrast between them: autocracy, backbone, strategy, politics, something else?
I would say backbone is the most obvious - Zhao Xinci is very sure of himself while Minister Gao is more insecure.
You also make a very good observation that Minister Gao actually has a more liberal stance towards Dixingren compared to Zhao Xinci. I never really noticed that :D
To what degree and in what ways do you think the show supports or condemns Zhao Xinci as a bureaucrat (as opposed to as a parent or a cop)?
There’s a scene towards the end (episode 38) where Zhao Xinci straight-up says ‘you and I were wrong and we fucked up’. It’s an open acknowledgment of failure as a leader and decision-maker – at the same time, admitting this out loud is a redemption. He also tries to fix things immediately.
He’s painted as someone earnestly trying to fill his position well, but his own bias and stubborn nature get in his way. I don’t know if I would call that condemnation.
What do you think Zhao Xinci's office is like? Does he spend much time there?
Good question! I bet he has exactly one picture of his wife & son, and one ugly modern artsy decorative object. Everything else is practical and impersonal.
He spends way too much time there.
What about other bureaucrats in the show -- Vice Minister Guo, the university chancellor, the Regent, the Deacon? How do they compare and contrast? Who are foils for whom?
Guo Ying is the only decent person of the bunch, a big contrast to everyone else.
Fuck, Marry, Kill: Gao Jingfeng, Zhao Xinci, The Regent.
Marry Zhao Xinci (spend his money while he works), kill The Regent (he needs to go), fuck Gao Jingfeng (by process of elimination).
Oh god
I'm afraid I didn't have many insights to add but thank you for the interesting topic :D
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Me too. And Dixing is like a parody of government: a randomly appointed king who has his life force sucked out of his by endless paperwork, and an evil, self-serving Regent. /o\
Love how brazenly he lies here. Oh no, this is totally not a lecture XD
It's very "No offence, but [offensive thing]," isn't it? *g*
It seems like a natural consequence of Zhao Xinci having an additional connection to a main character by being Zhao Yunlan’s father, while Gao has no other role than The Minister.
Yes, good point! The connection, plus all the seething feelings that come with their history. Vice Minister Guo being Changcheng's uncle makes him more interesting than he would otherwise be, too, for that matter.
Maybe something like Haixing’s equivalent of the CCP?
Yeah, maybe. I wonder what titles they have...
I honestly don’t think it would be that different. My reasoning is that while Zhao Xinci is temporarily acting as SID chief, he doesn’t exactly change his ways either.
Agreed. In fact, oh, that's one of the ways I think he's rather like Zhao Yunlan: they both bull-headedly do what they think needs doing, regardless of their job descriptions. ;-p
I would say backbone is the most obvious - Zhao Xinci is very sure of himself while Minister Gao is more insecure.
Yeah, I think Minister Gao is fairly comfortable when it's BAU; he's just terrible at managing new difficult situations... or at seeing past public opinion. (In fact, his willingness to throw the SID under the bus is kind of his low point, in some ways. Managers should defend their teams! Whereas I feel like in some ways Zhao Xinci's reaction is more a "no point shutting the stable door after the horse has bolted" attitude, once the Dept of Supervision has swung into action? Idk. I do have a tendency to make excuses for him. /o\)
There’s a scene towards the end (episode 38) where Zhao Xinci straight-up says ‘you and I were wrong and we fucked up’.
Ooh! I had to go look that up -- ah, when he's speaking to Minister Gao? "You, me, and Ouyang Zhen were all wrong. I will put forth a motion in the Bureau to temporarily take over your executive powers." That one? (This makes me wonder if the Xingdu Bureau is actually the top of the ladder after all.)
He’s painted as someone earnestly trying to fill his position well, but his own bias and stubborn nature get in his way. I don’t know if I would call that condemnation.
Yeah, in some ways I think of it as a surprisingly un-condemnatory portrayal. I really like how shades-of-grey it is.
He spends way too much time there.
Hee! <3
Marry Zhao Xinci (spend his money while he works), kill The Regent (he needs to go), fuck Gao Jingfeng (by process of elimination).
Oh god
LOL! Sorry! (I'm with you on the Regent!)
Thanks for your thoughts! <33333
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Yes, and in Guo Ying’s case it’s even more extreme. If he wasn’t Xiao-Guo’s uncle, there wouldn’t be much left of him as a character at all – inviting Weilan over for Changcheng’s birthday, playing Mahjongg with
the son-in-lawChu Shuzhi, they mystery of who sent Xiao-Guo to the SID… none of that could happen.they both bull-headedly do what they think needs doing, regardless of their job descriptions. ;-p
True! Not that either of them would admit to any similarity XD
"You, me, and Ouyang Zhen were all wrong. I will put forth a motion in the Bureau to temporarily take over your executive powers." That one?
Yes, that’s the line I meant.
It’s a nice touch to his character that he isn’t too proud to admit he messed up. And that in turn makes it all the more clear he really doesn’t think he’s in the wrong at other times.
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Yes, very true. He'd just be the polite and upright DoS lackey. :-)
Not that either of them would admit to any similarity XD
This makes me wonder what traits Zhao Yunlan might have got from his mum.
It’s a nice touch to his character that he isn’t too proud to admit he messed up.
Yes, agreed. I wonder if the general culture of self-criticism contributes to that -- like the way apologies are often met with people meeting the apologiser half way, even if it's a stretch (like Shen Wei apologising for not noticing the hidden banner cam). Most of the time, Zhao Xinci is all gruffly, "No point looking back or revisiting the past," you know?
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Oh good point! Yes that could absolutely contribute - as someone from a culture where meeting halfway like this would be met with confusion and annoyance, I can’t possibly be the judge though XD
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