Focus on: Zhao Yunlan confronting Ye Zun in the park from episode 20

[trickytricky]

Location of scene: Episode 20, 33:35-43:55

Apologies in advance for the length guys (and the extreme lateness; this should have gone up over the weekend… sorry!). When I chose this scene I didn’t quite realize how long it stretched… it covers about ten minutes of screen time! And I miiight have gotten a bit carried away with the gif-making. There just ended up being so many interesting moments I wanted to highlight where the expressions/visuals were just too great.

The gist of the scene involves Ye Zun, having newly-gained enough freedom to project his image/some portion of his powers from the pillar and interact with the world (thanks to Zhu Jiu just finishing up collecting enough human sacrifices for him earlier this episode, including sacrificing himself), summoning Zhao Yunlan to meet with him. It starts off with Ye Zun actively trying to gain sympathy, maintaining a courteous demeanor, and offering justifications for the murders he directed. However, from the beginning and maintained throughout, although Zhao Yunlan plays along a bit at first, he remains very clear-eyed about Ye Zun’s actual motivations and eventually makes it obvious that he’s not interested in indulging the facade of excuses.

At that point, Ye Zun drops his pretense of benevolence and goes in for the kill, but is shocked to find that Zhao Yunlan not only has the Longevity Dial in his possession, but that he can activate it and use its energy to (temporarily) hold off Ye Zun’s dark energy assault. Zhao Yunlan’s stalling ends up successfully buying himself enough time for Shen Wei to show up with his Big Damn Hero entrance to banish Ye Zun’s projection back to the pillar in Dixing, but the damage from Zhao Yunlan using the Dial to hold off Ye Zun’s attack has already been done. Everyone is appalled when they realize some combination of the influx of Hallow/dark energy has caused Zhao Yunlan to lose his sight.

We start off with Ya Qing seeking out Zhao Yunlan (and Zhu Hong who is with him) at Ye Zun’s direction and guiding them to the park where he is waiting. She’s pretty formal about the whole thing, addressing Zhao Yunlan by his ‘Master of the Guardians’ title and greeting Ye Zun with a respectful bow when they arrive. She addresses Ye Zun as “lăobăn” (boss), which seems to be the typical term his subordinates use.


Timed for when Zhu Hong and Zhao Yunlan arrive, Ye Zun is stretching his neck, groaning and sighing a little in performative relief, establishing the play on sympathy he’s going for right from the start. When he turns to face them, he addresses only Zhao Yunlan. He introduces himself and bows in a formal, old-fashioned manner; meanwhile Zhao Yunlan gives an insouciant little one-handed wave in response while his other hand remains in his pocket, making an exaggerated face and a wordless noise of greeting that encompasses both acknowledgement and epic levels of unimpress-edness all at once.



They exchange a few words at this point, with Ye Zun claiming credit as the ‘boss’ working behind the scenes to direct Zhu Jiu and Ya Qing, Zhao Yunlan expressing polite skepticism about his stated intentions of having sought him out for a ‘sincere meeting’, but still willing to play along for now, and then Ye Zun rolls right into his prepared justifications for his actions, that he’s only acting in the best interests of all Dixingren, who have been unfairly forced to remain in a harmful status quo by humanity.

I do find it interesting to note in this section that while he does it with a deceptively light tone of voice, once of the very first things Zhao Yunlan firmly establishes in this bit of the initial conversation is that he is aligned with Shen Wei/Hei Pao Shi in this struggle, with, 'Can you take the mask off your face first? As you act as the final villain, why must you imitate my friend, Hei Pao Shi? It really bothers me.'


Brief intermission to highlight the TRUE star of this scene, my girl, Zhu Hong, whose face absolutely encompasses The Best reaction to Ye Zun's attempts at justifications.


Ahem. Moving right along, Zhao Yunlan, dripping skepticism at this point, picks up and states out loud what Ye Zun has been strongly implying, that all the harm Ye Zun has done has actually been in service of the noble motive of liberating the people of Dixing. He has some flowery speechification about sunflowers and the sun, rivers and the sea, and concludes with an appeal that doesn’t Zhao Yunlan agree with what he’s doing in order to lead the people of Dixing up to the surface? As Zhao Yunlan shrugs, scoffs, and light-heartedly replies, Ye Zun’s pasted-on smile drops. “I don’t think so. All I see is that you confused them to work for you to death and provoke war under the excuse of resources.” Zhao Yunlan drops his own lighthearted mask at this point and gets deadly serious while cutting to the heart of the matter. “You killed so many humans, so many Dixingren, only for your ambitions of returning to the world.”

Ye Zun hasn’t entirely given up on persuasion yet and tries one more time, again citing the different circumstances between Humans and Dixingren. “We Dixingren and human beings are totally different races. When you are eating meat and fish why didn’t you ever think of how precious life is?”

The bit where Ye Zun stresses here that their species are completely different is a recurring theme, and it will come up again and again, both with him working to fervently establish this division and Zhao Yunlan and Shen Wei working to knock it down throughout the narrative. It’s not an accident he repeatedly hammers on this point, as ‘othering’ the enemy you are inciting your people into a violent frenzy to attack is one of the most common cornerstones of the kind of manipulation that Ye Zun is deliberating plying as he seeks to stoke the hostilities that will help establish himself as a supreme power.

Meanwhile, Zhao Yunlan cuts through his attempt to claim the ‘fighting-for-the-oppressed-people-of-Dixing’ high ground by asking him pointedly about Zhu Jiu.


I found this reaction fascinating when I watched the scene, when Ye Zun turns with his hand over his mouth. This is the first moment in the scene that didn’t feel rehearsed/deliberately manipulative from Ye Zun...that he genuinely didn’t expect to be challenged on having eaten his loyal subordinate, and that he had to scramble for a moment to come up with a justification for it, even to himself.


And what does he come up with? ‘Ah, no, you don’t understand… me eating him was a good thing! His life and all his future potential was so meaningless that being food for me is truly the most satisfying and fulfilling end he could have achieved!’ Mmmmmm hmmmmm. (Zhu Hong isn’t buying it either. Look, I say again, she’s the true star of this scene, these are just facts. FEARLESSLY CALLING OUT VIOLENT, SELF-ABSORBED FASCISTS ON THEIR CRAP, I LOVE U SO MUCH. That's why you get a bigger gif, YOU DESERVE IT.)


(And just gonna throw this in here for funsies from another episode, but seriously, the SID team exuding pure, high-octane, impatient, defiant sass in the face of monologuing villains gives me LIFE.)


Zhao Yunlan takes the opportunity of being close to Zhu Hong to get her to secretly pass him the Longevity Dial… he has also entirely stopped playing along at this point and is openly cold and angry. “Do you think you can take other people’s lives casually as your nutrition just because you’re here posing and preaching sermons?” Ye Zun entirely drops his pleasant/persuasive mask as well and transforms his projection into a larger, looming version, apparently picking up that there’s nothing he can say that will convince Zhao Yunlan that his choice to murder/eat people to gain his freedom and his ongoing determination to incite the Dixing people to violent attacks under his leadership is justifiable. Ye Zun lashes out at Zhao Yunlan with his dark energy, and Zhao Yunlan flings up an arm in defense, and the scene quickly cuts to Shen Wei arriving at the Ministry, sensing something amiss (someone is clearly touching Hallows who shouldn’t be…), and nyooming off to the rescue.

I find it noteworthy in this section first, that Zhao Yunlan as a character is so unhesitatingly clear-eyed about Ye Zun’s true motivations right from the start, and second, that even this early, in his first major appearance, Ye Zun so very quickly gave up the pretence of noble motives and acknowledged his own earlier justifications as ‘nonsense’ basically as soon as it became obvious they had failed to convince.


Back to the main conflict, we see both Ye Zun and Zhao Yunlan coming to the realization that Zhao Yunlan successfully used the energy of the Longevity Dial to repel Ye Zun’s attack; ZYL laughs a little triumphantly, and Ye Zun takes on an air of almost fearful reverence, holding out his hands, trembling, in the direction of the Dial. This is clearly what he’s truly after… the power of the Hallows.

Zhao Yunlan has plastered on a thin veneer of cockiness and gloats a bit about how Ye Zun seems to have been exaggerating his current level of power. There’s some exposition about how when the energy of a magnetic field collides with dark energy, it forms a ‘protective film’ (apparently the principle they use for the SID HQ shield). Zhao Yunlan is trying to project confidence here, but he’s tense and knows he’s on shaky ground.


Ye Zun is clearly shaken by the reveal of the Dial, he’s wide-eyed and holding out his hands in supplication for it, his voice starts of fairly subdued, but quickly gains confidence and intensity as he goes on, “As long as...as long as you give me the Hallow now, I promise you… I’ll leave here at once.” Zhao Yunlan scoffs at this with a feisty rejection, but soon has to expend all of his effort just to hold off the energy attack Ye Zun renews. The more visibly Zhao Yunlan struggles and shows pain, the more fun Ye Zun is clearly having on the other side, keeping up his attack, smiling and laughing.


During the stand-off Ye Zun takes a moment to observe that time is very much against Zhao Yunlan here… the longer the dead-lock goes on, the more counter-effects he’ll suffer from the energy; the toll is already beginning to show. And then there’s this iconic line: “You struggle so hard for those ignorant humans. Why go through all the trouble?” I feel like this really gets to the heart of how good vs evil is depicted in this show. Those who are ‘good’ try to undertake actions that will serve and protect those who are just trying to live their lives in peace, while those who are evil fundamentally reject this worldview, cannot even fathom why someone would be willing to sacrifice for others, and delight in harming others, inciting violence, work to accrue power, both political and tangible, at the direct expense/harm of others.

Of course, this is a worldview Zhao Yunlan as the protagonist soundly rejects, “You think it is a hardship, but I enjoy it.” He says this a little bit tongue-in-cheek, and it would be easy to dismiss as him just mouthing off in a show of defiance to the baddie, but I think it gets at a deeper truth, too. For him, happiness/fulfillment/true, lasting joy in life isn’t just about getting to live comfortably and safe for himself… it’s something that can be found in the values of service and sacrifice and knowing you’ve helped others. He’s clearly struggling and in pain there, so sure, he’s not exactly straight-forwardly ‘enjoying’ what he’s going through in that moment, but he’s absolutely saying that he’s exactly where he wants to be, would always choose to be, that he finds real satisfaction and meaning in standing up to those who would take pleasure in hurting others, even if it results in pain and loss and there isn’t any tangible reward to be gained from it.


Ah, and then, of course, Zhao Yunlan’s determined holding on and attempts at stalling pay off as he finally spots “someone who’s going to win…” out of the corner of his eye. Aaaand the Big Damn Hero moment we’ve been waiting for.


Shen Wei has a brief face-off with Ye Zun’s projection after his dramatic blow against the dueling energies knocked everyone back. Shen Wei’s first instinct is to call out to check on Zhao Yunlan, but when he gets no response, he brings his attention right back around to the remaining threat. Ye Zun is clearly living his best life up in here at this point, delighting in how distressed Shen Wei looks and looking to exchange some gloating pleasantries. Shen Wei’s in full, grim Hei Pao Shi-mode though, and between the attack he barely arrived in time to stop, and Zhao Yunlan’s failure to respond behind him, he clearly has no patience for games and banishes Ye Zun back to his confinement with a swing of his glaive. (It’s interesting that he used his sword to strike at the energies, but transforms it [swaps it out?] into its glaive form to banish Ye Zun’s projection.)

Ya Qing, seeing the tides have decidedly turned, shifts into crow form and flies away, and back at the pillar, Ye Zun’s energy is shown flying back into it. The Regent and his assistant are watching, and we get this pithy observation, “I told you. It’s still too early to decide the fate of both sides.”


Returning to our protagonists, here, have some gratuitously pretty Shen Wei-Twirling-His-Glaive and Tenderness and Hands and Sweet, Sweet Smiles all around!


And, to wrap up the scene, there’s a lovely little bit where we get to see Zhao Yunlan scraping up against the edges of one of the remaining hidden facets that Shen Wei, I-am-a-Matryoshka-doll-of-secrets-within-secrets, is still holding onto when he comments that Ye Zun looked strangely familiar… Then, we get the slow rising dread as Zhu Hong and Shen Wei realize that Zhao Yunlan has lost his sight, and Zhao Yunlan’s own painful realization. And we fade to black!


A few interesting tie-in scenes here!


The exchange in this scene was absolutely what later tips Zhao Yunlan off in episode 34 that it’s Ye Zun impersonating Shen Wei… Ye Zun still fails to appreciate that one can find deep, sustaining joy and fulfillment from helping/protecting others even without the short-lived pleasure of domination and without expectation of reward.


The question of Ye Zun’s underlying motivations comes up several more times in the show, and it does always impress me with how much skill Zhao Yunlan consistently displays at seeing through surface facades to the deeper truth of people… He has Ye Zun’s number immediately and never falls into the trap of self-doubt despite multiple attempts to convince him otherwise. Ye Zun, self-admitted when he thinks it won’t derail his true agenda, has no interest in ‘saving’ Dixing, or reforming/re-building anything for the better… he wants to manipulate the people of Dixing into a violent, nationalistic fervor, to incite them into committing genocide against two species, and then intends to tear into whatever Dixingren are left alive in the wake of those invasions, to kill any of his own remaining people who he deems ‘disobedient’... because the world can be a brutal place, and he has personally suffered in it, therefore he seeks to hurt people back indiscriminately in turn with the immense, god-like powers he attained, inflicting the same trauma he suffered himself on everyone around him rather than doing what he can to mitigate that harm to others now that he’s in a position to do so.

Here are a few questions that came to mind to lead-off discussion... feel free to address any of these that spark interest, or bring up anything else that you found particularly engaging in this scene!

• Was there anything Ye Zun could have said or offered in this scene, at this point in the story given what Zhao Yunlan has already seen and experienced with Zhu Jiu on Ye Zun’s behalf, that would have shaken Zhao Yunlan’s convictions or persuaded him to support his cause?
• Do you think Ye Zun made any efforts to use his mind control powers to influence Zhao Yunlan in this scene… was that the point of the performative manipulations, courtesy, and probing nature of the conversation at the beginning, but Zhao Yunlan was able to resist the attempts to influence him or was all the verbal probing and attempts at eliciting sympathy *because* he couldn’t exercise his powers at that point, and was forced to attempt to suborn the SID Chief the ‘old-fashioned’ way? (Can Ye Zun influence minds as a projection at all, or does he only have that ability in person?)
• When Zhao Yunlan points out that for someone claiming to be acting in accordance with the interests of Dixing, he seems to have no compunction about killing and consuming them, including his followers, Ye Zun holds his hand in a gesture over his mouth for a moment before snarling out justifications. Was that a movement that just reflected his reminiscence about the taste/sensation he experienced when consuming Zhu Jiu? Was there an instant of guilt/shame there that drove him to cover his face before he shook it off and rejected any wrong-doing?
• Why does Shen Wei hide the fact that Ye Zun is his brother from Zhao Yunlan, in this scene, as well as not confessing his suspicions about the identity of the 'person behind the scenes' previous to this and after? There are many potential reasons, I’m curious to hear what you think the primary motivation is there!

So, come on over and chime in with your thoughts! (If you actually managed to make it all the way through this ridiculously bloated post, that is...) If you have any links to meta, picspams, and related fanworks, new or old, please share them here! Self-recs are wholeheartedly encouraged. If you have any thoughts to share or links you think would be relevant to this scene, we’d love to hear them.

Comments

[shipperslist]

This is an excellent post and not a bit too long. I'm just gonna sit back, stare at the gifs, and marvel Zhu Yilong's skill.

[trickytricky]

Thanks, that's good to hear!

And, right?? He is such an incredible actor. I know other people have said this before, but it is very much true for me... Shen Wei and Ye Zun ping in my brain as entirely different people; even knowing they're played by the same actor, my brain tends to just sliiiide right on past that and not even register it as a fact when I see either of the respective characters on screen. (And then I watched Lost Tomb Reboot, and he's entirely reinvented yet again! Every now and then he'll tilt his head a certain way in that show, and I'll just be jolted with the reminder, 'oh, right, Shen Wei!!!' because I managed to forget while watching this completely new and original portrayal.)

[imashoe]

Ooh, great post! This is such an interesting scene.

I'm pretty sympathetic to Ye Zun as a character, but, wow, was his speech here annoying even by megalomaniac villain standards.

Was there anything Ye Zun could have said or offered in this scene, at this point in the story given what Zhao Yunlan has already seen and experienced with Zhu Jiu on Ye Zun’s behalf, that would have shaken Zhao Yunlan’s convictions or persuaded him to support his cause?

There was nothing. No way. I think it's pretty clear from Zhao Yunlan's little wave in greeting where he's standing in this conflict, while Ye Zun can't understand Zhao Yunlan's perspective in order to craft a persuasive argument. There are always good points to be made re. Dixing-Haixing relations, but Ye Zun's arguments are twisted by his own blinkered perspective. He wants to be the most powerful being so he'll feel safe, which means that he also believes it's inevitable that the strong prey on the weak. That's not a worldview conducive to crafting an argument that would appeal to someone as compassionate as Zhao Yunlan.

Do you think Ye Zun made any efforts to use his mind control powers to influence Zhao Yunlan in this scene… was that the point of the performative manipulations, courtesy, and probing nature of the conversation at the beginning, but Zhao Yunlan was able to resist the attempts to influence him or was all the verbal probing and attempts at eliciting sympathy *because* he couldn’t exercise his powers at that point, and was forced to attempt to suborn the SID Chief the ‘old-fashioned’ way? (Can Ye Zun influence minds as a projection at all, or does he only have that ability in person?)

It would make sense if he was trying to use his mind control powers, because I can't tell what the point of his entire speech is at all. It's interesting that Ye Zun gains the ability to leave his pillar like this and he immediately goes to meet Zhao Yunlan though. Makes me wonder what his fixation is all about, how much of it is tactical because Zhao Yunlan is the Lord Guardian and has some of the Hallows, and how much is hitting at someone Shen Wei loves.

When Zhao Yunlan points out that for someone claiming to be acting in accordance with the interests of Dixing, he seems to have no compunction about killing and consuming them, including his followers, Ye Zun holds his hand in a gesture over his mouth for a moment before snarling out justifications. Was that a movement that just reflected his reminiscence about the taste/sensation he experienced when consuming Zhu Jiu? Was there an instant of guilt/shame there that drove him to cover his face before he shook it off and rejected any wrong-doing?

Ye Zun's expression almost looks like horror to me. I don't think there's necessarily canon evidence for this, but perhaps it's traumatic for him to use his power. Maybe not every time, but it's such an sucky (errr..) power, and it was awakened in such awful circumstances, that it could be argued it's not really pleasant to use. I believe it's dawning horror at what he did--eating his most loyal follower for world domination reasons--and the ensuing self-doubt is something he absolutely can't afford, so of course he immediately goes the "it's actually great to be eaten by me" route.

Why does Shen Wei hide the fact that Ye Zun is his brother from Zhao Yunlan, in this scene, as well as not confessing his suspicions about the identity of the 'person behind the scenes' previous to this and after? There are many potential reasons, I’m curious to hear what you think the primary motivation is there!

Like you say, there are many potential reasons, but I think it's a mix of practical concerns regarding what he can reveal without endangering the timeline and his own guilt regarding what happened to Ye Zun in the past. Also habitual, pathological self-reliance.

[trickytricky]

There was nothing. No way.
I tend to be with you on that. At this point we've seen Zhao Yunlan being willing to bend the rules past the point of breaking in favor of mercy/compassion before (wanting a hopeful outcome for Wang Yike despite her murders; not wanting Zheng Yi to face harsh justice for the people she killed/follow-on attacks she was pressured to commit; working to talk Ye Huo and his companions down rather than throw the book at them despite their violence and hostage taking), but Ye Zun goes way beyond just acting in direct retaliation for grievous harm, or just in his own defense... Zhao Yunlan has seen how he directs indiscriminate killing to benefit himself and knows that as the person working behind the scenes his primary goal/ motivation is to incite (another) violent invasion of Haixing and seize power for himself in the doing... unless Ye Zun was able to convince him somehow that there was a misunderstanding, that his involvement in these things was not true to begin with/are no longer his intentions now (which is probably impossible for him to do because they actually *are* and always were his intentions and Zhao Yunlan is sharp enough to see the truth), then his effort to persuade Zhao Yunlan to be sympathetic to his cause and potentially create a crack of divisiveness/seed of doubt in the ranks of his enemies was doomed from the start.

how much of it is tactical because Zhao Yunlan is the Lord Guardian and has some of the Hallows, and how much is hitting at someone Shen Wei loves.
Oh, very much me too! It struck me all over again when capping this scene, that this isn't some chance encounter or side-operation... pretty much the first thing he does when able to project out is send Ya Qing to specifically fetch Zhao Yunlan to have a face-to-face chat with. I think a fair amount of it must be just the ego of it, introducing himself to the SID leader as a major player on the stage, insisting on that recognition for himself as a Great Power to be reckoned with by Zhao Yunlan, rather than him just seeing his intermediaries and not knowing/respecting/fearing him, the true power behind them. Zhu Jiu was very focused on both Hei Pao Shi as a threat, but also on the SID as a real adversary, and he would have conveyed that to Ye Zun. But I also agree, I think there's definitely a certain amount of poking at this 'weak' spot that his brother has, as well. You can see how borderline gleeful he is about it when Shen Wei shows up at the end, so pleased that his attack against this specific person provoked such a dramatic reaction.

I believe it's dawning horror at what he did
Conveying horror with a hand over one's mouth is certainly a possibility! There's a lot of places where one could go with this gesture and what it means; could be shame, horror, involuntary reaction to one's own deceit, surprise/disbelief at what someone else has said... or some combination of any of these.

a mix of practical concerns regarding what he can reveal without endangering the timeline and his own guilt regarding what happened to Ye Zun in the past. Also habitual, pathological self-reliance.
I can easily see all of this being at play, and would probably pile on in addition to those, some deep-down part of him being afraid that Zhao Yunlan and the other SID members might judge him for/associate him with Ye Zun's atrocities if they knew how closely he was connected to him.

[trickytricky]

(Also, this is a not-at-all serious response to your very excellent, very thoughtful comment, but this just popped into my head today and I just had to share it:

- Ye Zun as a Patient: "Hey, doc, I get a really unpleasant sensation when I eat other people, can you do something about that?"
- Doctor: "Have you tried... not eating people?") 😂

[imashoe]

LOL. It's funny 'cause it's true.

[marycrawford]

Somehow all the text is showing up extra small in this post -- not sure if this is a problem on my end or if something went wrong with the coding? It's just this post, not others on DW. I will be back with commentary when I can stop staring at the gifs :D

[trickytricky]

I went in and made some adjustments to the text size, so hopefully it's a bit more readable now!

[marycrawford]

Thanks, that helped! I love your overview of this scene, and the props to Zhu Hong who is Best Snek. <3

That limp, unimpressed little wave of ZYL's is sending me. "epic levels of unimpress-edness" yes indeed. It's such a typical ZYL response to someone trying to impress/threaten and I love it.

For him, happiness/fulfillment/true, lasting joy in life isn’t just about getting to live comfortably and safe for himself… it’s something that can be found in the values of service and sacrifice and knowing you’ve helped others. He’s clearly struggling and in pain there, so sure, he’s not exactly straight-forwardly ‘enjoying’ what he’s going through in that moment, but he’s absolutely saying that he’s exactly where he wants to be, would always choose to be, that he finds real satisfaction and meaning in standing up to those who would take pleasure in hurting others, even if it results in pain and loss and there isn’t any tangible reward to be gained from it.

The trouble with a really good writeup is that I just want to go THIS YES THIS times a million, but--yes this! He is such a damn hero, he's ready to lay his life on the line any damn time, and that is also why he and SW are such a good team. And why YZ could not understand this mindset, when he is all petulance and selfish greed.

[trobadora]

Thank you for this detailed look at a great scene! The last part, after Ye Zun is banished, is one of my favourite bits. Zhao Yunlan's "I knew you'd come" and all the smiles, and then the reveal about his vision ... ♥

The bit where Ye Zun stresses here that their species are completely different is a recurring theme, and it will come up again and again, both with him working to fervently establish this division and Zhao Yunlan and Shen Wei working to knock it down throughout the narrative.

This is an excellent observation!

Was there anything Ye Zun could have said or offered in this scene, at this point in the story given what Zhao Yunlan has already seen and experienced with Zhu Jiu on Ye Zun’s behalf, that would have shaken Zhao Yunlan’s convictions or persuaded him to support his cause?

No, I really can't see it. Zhao Yunlan has seen too much of how Ye Zun operates. Maybe if Ye Zun had blamed everything on Zhu Jiu going off script while he himself had no power to interfere, he could have made himself look better – but with Ya Qing standing right there, that would have been hard to pull off. And besides, Ye Zun is totally incapable of grasping Zhao Yunlan's worldview sufficiently to even think of such a plan, let alone execute it convincingly.

Do you think Ye Zun made any efforts to use his mind control powers to influence Zhao Yunlan in this scene…

That makes sense to me - if he can use his various powers as a projection, he'll definitely have tried. But I have no firm convictions either way. *g*

Was that a movement that just reflected his reminiscence about the taste/sensation he experienced when consuming Zhu Jiu? Was there an instant of guilt/shame there that drove him to cover his face before he shook it off and rejected any wrong-doing?

I thought it was just a gesture trying to cover the fact that he’s been called out on something he didn't have an answer prepared for.

Why does Shen Wei hide the fact that Ye Zun is his brother from Zhao Yunlan, in this scene, as well as not confessing his suspicions about the identity of the 'person behind the scenes' previous to this and after?

I think it's part because he’s trying to avoid questions about what happened 10,000 years ago (because Kunlun), and part because he feels ashamed and responsible for his brother and wants to handle this himself as much as he can.

[trickytricky]

God yes, the emotional pay-off of the utter faith rewarded, those smiles they all share as it sinks in that everyone managed to survive, the horror of the injury... that closing scene is perfection.

"Maybe if Ye Zun had blamed everything on Zhu Jiu going off script while he himself had no power to interfere, he could have made himself look better"
That's an interesting possibility that I hadn't thought all the way through, that Ye Zun could have tried to go the 'disclaim full knowledge of subordinate's actions' route... I don't think Zhao Yunlan would have been fooled by it for long, if he was drawn into it at all, he's incredibly observant where it comes to seeing beneath surface facades, but it could be a line that would have given Ye Zun a foot in the door, as it were. And yeah, he would have had to have either sent Ya Qing away, or let her know about the 'plan' in advance so her reactions would be in line.

"a gesture trying to cover the fact that he’s been called out on something he didn't have an answer prepared for."
I lean more in this direction myself... that it was more surprise/shock/dismay at not having expected this to be something he was challenged on, that he figured Zhao Yunlan wouldn't care about him eating his own people...they're his enemies after all... Ye Zun's 'right...right' and that little snarly lip curl after he's turned around to face Zhao Yunlan reads a little more like someone feeling backed into a corner who didn't expect it from this front and is defensive about it.

[thevetia]

I struck me from the first that Ye Zun's hand-over-mouth gesture indicated that he was savoring the memory of "eating" Zhu Jiu. In the close-up immediately following with his hand removed his grimace is almost bestial.

I know this isn't a popular take! But I feel this interpretation is reinforced in ep 34 when Zhao Yunlan ask Ye Zun as similar question, "What did you do to Lin Jing?" and Ye Zun conspicuously licks his lips with his tongue.

[trickytricky]

I don't know about popular or not, but it's definitely a take that can be easily supported from what we're shown by the character on screen. One of my first thoughts was that maybe he was experiencing a visceral memory of the taste/sensation of eating Zhu Jiu there; so specifically 'savoring' it in his memory would be a variation of that which makes a certain amount of sense. And, yeah, I saw that snarl too; whether he was finding pleasure in the memory or not, that was an unmitigated vicious expression to follow it up with.

And then, as you point out, in episode 34 we've got a quite-different-but-a-link-could-be-made expression when he is prompted to recall something harmful done to someone else, Lin Jing, where he does the infamous smug (savoring?) tongue-curl.


And when we actually see him consuming Lin Jing later, it looks even more clear to me that he's enjoying the sensation of eating someone (savoring it, as you put it), in the moment at least.


That is definitely a man who wholeheartedly enjoyed what he just did. He's pretty caught up in the experience as it's happening, but once he's finished killing Lin Jing, that smile goes all the way up to his eyes.

[grayswandir]

This scene fully deserved a long post! And I love all the gifs. :D Some of these bits go by so fast in the episode, it's really nice to see them in gif form where you can watch everything more closely. (Any minute now I'm going to stop rewatching that hand-holding moment at the end...)

(It’s interesting that he used his sword to strike at the energies, but transforms it [swaps it out?] into its glaive form to banish Ye Zun’s projection.)

I'd somehow never noticed this, but obviously it was very intentional! Apparently his weapons themselves have particular, different powers?

Do you think Ye Zun made any efforts to use his mind control powers to influence Zhao Yunlan in this scene…

It certainly seems likely, given what you point out about how he immediately drops his pretense of having honorable motives as soon as he realizes Zhao Yunlan isn't buying it. It seems likely that when he gives these same speeches to an audience that's more susceptible to mind-control, they probably perceive his arguments as being plausible. So when he sees that Zhao Yunlan isn't reacting the right way, he realizes his mind control isn't working... and he doesn't actually have any good arguments, so he just has to give up that whole game. I hadn't thought about it before, but the way you present it here, it really does seem to me like Ye Zun probably normally relies on mind-control to nudge people into accepting his bad justifications.

[nnozomi]

I'm late to the party, but this is a wonderful post, both the analysis and all the amazing visuals.

He introduces himself and bows in a formal, old-fashioned manner; meanwhile Zhao Yunlan gives an insouciant little one-handed wave in response
I love this exchange: two completely opposite styles of saying "you will find I am not someone to fuck with."

The bit where Ye Zun stresses here that their species are completely different is a recurring theme, and it will come up again and again, both with him working to fervently establish this division and Zhao Yunlan and Shen Wei working to knock it down throughout the narrative.
You make some great points here; also I feel like this goes straight back to 10,000 years ago, the Alliance of different species against the xenophobic Dixing rebels--if not taking the side he was forced into at that point, Ye Zun would have to start thinking about how he was abused and how maybe the things his abusers taught him were wrong...

Shen Wei arriving at the Ministry, sensing something amiss (someone is clearly touching Hallows who shouldn’t be…), and nyooming off to the rescue.
It breaks the tension but this scene always makes me giggle. Guo Ying: "Is Zhao Yunlan not with you?" Shen Wei: "Oh, he's...?...Damn--" *nyoom* (I think Shen Wei only curses two or three times in the whole thing) and poor Guo Ying standing there wondering what just happened.

For him, happiness/fulfillment/true, lasting joy in life isn’t just about getting to live comfortably and safe for himself… it’s something that can be found in the values of service and sacrifice and knowing you’ve helped others. He’s clearly struggling and in pain there, ... but he’s absolutely saying ... that he finds real satisfaction and meaning in standing up to those who would take pleasure in hurting others, even if it results in pain and loss and there isn’t any tangible reward to be gained from it.
This is a great insight, and connects directly to Zhao Yunlan taking on the Lantern at the end.