Focus on: Zhao Yunlan and Shen Wei in Shen Wei's office from episode 7

[sakana17]

Location of scene: Episode 7, 39:47-42:12

The SID has just closed the Lai Su case. Earlier in the episode (during the laptop scene), Shen Wei had told Zhao Yunlan he wanted to know the identity of the inhumane killer. Zhao Yunlan is in Shen Wei's office to tell him how the case resolved.


[Note: English dialogue taken from the solo QC subtitles]

The scene starts with Zhao Yunlan already in Shen Wei's office. He has told him about Lai Su and the case. He's sitting across from Shen Wei at Shen Wei's desk, and he's twiddling an ink brush in his fingers.



During the entire scene, Zhao Yunlan plays with the ink brush, at times holding it by the brush tip, not the handle. I think it's Shen Wei's ink brush--there is an ink brush holder on Shen Wei's desk with some other brushes hanging on it--but because we never see Zhao Yunlan pick it up or put it down, it's possible it might not be. Assuming it is Shen Wei's brush, this is another display of Zhao Yunlan helping himself to Shen Wei's stuff, à la eating his cake (in episode 3) and playing with his letter opener (in episode 6).



Shen Wei is dressed more casually than usual (no sweater, vest, or jacket, and no necktie) in a somewhat sporty shirt with vertical stripes down the arms. He's also not wearing sleeve garters.



Zhao Yunlan is wearing the same clothes he wore earlier while solving the case, so either Shen Wei changed his clothes during the day, or Zhao Yunlan hasn't changed his clothes in over a day.

This scene comes after two previous scenes that are set at night, but the lighting in Shen Wei's office is ambiguous for determining time of day. There's a "night" feel to it to me, because we don't see/hear anyone else in the hallway outside his office.

Shen Wei asks Zhao Yunlan if Zhao Yunlan thinks Lai Su reaped what he sowed. Zhao Yunlan replies that he can't say for sure, but he's fairly certain that Lai Su had Dixing genes he didn't know about. He theorizes that Lai Su's Dixing power was to self-hypnotize, and that Lai Su and the monster he wrote about were one in the same. When Lai Su prematurely wrote about the monster's death, the monster counter-attacked, engulfed him, and killed him.

Shen Wei says that Zhao Yunlan's theory is possible, but because Lai Su is dead, there's no way to verify it.

Zhao Yunlan then makes a little moralizing speech about Lai Su overusing his power so the monster overwhelmed him, and that greed and ambition triggered Lai Su's self-hypnosis. With this speech, Zhao Yunlan seems to be giving a delayed "yes" response to Shen Wei's earlier question about Lai Su reaping what he sowed.

The next thing Zhao Yunlan says is: "Don't authors always say that the moment they raise their pen, the characters already possess their own life and will?"

Note: The line in Chinese is: "作家们不是经常说吗，当他们开始动笔的那一刻起，这个角色就有了自己的生命和自己的意志。" In English, there is an ambiguity with "characters" which I don't think exists in the original. The Chinese used is 角色 (jué sè) = character, role, part. In English, the word "character" is often used for Chinese logograms (hanzi). (I'm not an expert in Mandarin. If I've misinterpreted this, please let me know! ** Thank you for the correction, grayswandir!)

When Zhao Yunlan says the bit about "raise their pen," he gestures with the ink brush as if making a stroke of a hanzi.



Then Zhao Yunlan says: "All life's a play.[*] Hey, who knows, the two of us right now might be characters in someone's book."

[*] Note: The Chinese is: "人生如戏" (rénshēng rú xì), a four-character idiomatic expression. Link to a scholarly paper about this expression (see especially section 4.3).



After this, Shen Wei's expressions change. He's no longer in "case analysis mode." Shen Wei smiles a little.



Zhao Yunlan smiles back.



Shen Wei says: "I never thought that I'd hear you say something like this." He's very serious. Zhao Yunlan looks at him, also serious.



Shen Wei continues: "And I expected even less that one day you would empathize with the plight of the Dixing people." It looks like he's tearing up.



Zhao Yunlan's initial reaction to this is also serious.



They stare at each other for a moment. Then Zhao Yunlan's manner shifts. He makes a little sound, tilts his head, raises a finger, and sort of points in Shen Wei's direction.



He says: "You know what... I didn't think there'd be a day like this myself." Said with a little laugh and smile.



Shen Wei lowers his eyes with a small smile. He makes a soft breathy sound that's between a snort and a laugh.



Then he looks up at Zhao Yunlan again. With teary/watery eyes.



Then looks down, to the side, with more of a smile.



Shen Wei doesn't say anything. He sits back.

Zhao Yunlan, serious again, looks off to one side and says he keeps feeling like "we're[*] facing stormy weather," and looks at Shen Wei.

[*] Note: The original is "龙城的阴雨时刻要到了" which I think means something like "Dragon City is facing stormy weather." I wanted to note this, because the English "we're" could imply he's only talking about himself and Shen Wei, or only talking about the SID, but he means all of Dragon City. (Again, I'm not an expert in Mandarin, so please correct me if I'm misinterpreting!)

Shen Wei is looking down. In reaction, he has a slight brow crease and looks at Zhao Yunlan. They look at each other, serious, and the scene ends. It's also the end of the episode.

I chose this scene is because I think it's an interesting stepping stone in the development of Shen Wei and Zhao Yunlan's relationship.

Episode 7 begins with Zhao Yunlan saving Shen Wei from the muggers in the alley. Then there's the liniment scene, where Zhao Yunlan asks Shen Wei to become SID's consultant, and Shen Wei turns him down. Next is the laptop scene, where Zhao Yunlan wants Shen Wei to give him information about Dixingren to help the case. Their scenes in this episode prior to this one contain Zhao Yunlan pursuing & trying to get information from Shen Wei.

This scene doesn't. Even when Zhao Yunlan theorizes about Lai Su having Dixing genes, he doesn't ask it in a way that pushes Shen Wei for an answer. And when Shen Wei says they can't know now, Zhao Yunlan accepts this.

Zhao Yunlan not only says some moralizing things about Lai Su (revealing his own opinions) but he gets a little philosophical. And Shen Wei is very moved by this and tells him so. They are really interacting like equals, like friends, in this scene.

Questions:
1. Why does Shen Wei ask Zhao Yunlan if Lai Su reaped what he sowed? What kind of answer, if any, does he expect (or want) from Zhao Yunlan?

2. There are some obvious meta meanings to Zhao Yunlan's "the two of us right now might be characters in someone's book." What's Zhao Yunlan's meaning? And why is Shen Wei so moved by it?

3. When Shen Wei opens up and tells him he never expected Zhao Yunlan to say these things, what does Zhao Yunlan's reaction (with the laugh) mean? What does Shen Wei think after that reaction?

4. Does Zhao Yunlan know (as opposed to suspect) by now that Shen Wei is Dixingren? If so, what does this mean for Shen Wei? If he's still trying to hide that he's Dixingren, isn't he giving it away with what he says about Zhao Yunlan empathizing with the plight of Dixingren (and how he says it)? Or is giving it away Shen Wei's intention?

So, come and have your say! Share links to meta, picspams, and related fanworks, new or old! Self-recs are wholeheartedly encouraged. Basically, this is the place for anything you want to say or link to about this scene.

Comments

[grayswandir]

Eee, what a gorgeous recap of this scene. I love all the detail (and all the screencaps!).

another display of Zhao Yunlan helping himself to Shen Wei's stuff

Hah -- I hadn't even thought about it, because it seems a lot more innocuous to pick up someone's pen (or brush, as the case may be) than to just start eating their cake, but... yeah, it is sort of the same idea. Fortunately, Shen Wei seems to mostly enjoy Zhao Yunlan's total lack of boundaries...

he's fairly certain that Lai Su had Dixing genes he didn't know about

So, I know it's not really the point under discussion here, but I find this bit to be one of the most interesting things about this scene, because I think it's the only place we hear about the possibility of someone having Dixing genes but not being fully Dixingren? Which, if true, suggests that humans and Dixingren can reproduce together, I would assume? I mean, I suppose it's also possible that genetics from one species could have been transferred to another by some other means (e.g. through some Haixing Lab type experimentation or by someone's Dixing power or whatever), but I feel like the implication is that somehow, the alien origins of Dixingren notwithstanding, the two species are similar enough that their genes can actually mix.

Which, if so... like... what would they do with such a person, if they discovered someone who was part Dixingren, but also part human? Would that person fall under the Envoy's jurisdiction or not? Does the Treaty even account for this possibility? And how many people might be roaming around Haixing with traces of Dixing ancestry and no idea about it?

I don't know, this whole possibility is just fascinating to me. But anyway!

The Chinese used is 角色就 (jué sè jiù) = character, role, part

I'm also by no means an expert in Chinese, but I think the relevant part here is just 角色 (character, role, part) -- the 就 is just a grammatical item, part of the rest of the sentence. But yeah, definitely character as in "role" and not character as in writing.

Shen Wei continues: "And I expected even less that one day you would empathize with the plight of the Dixing people."

Which is kind of odd, given that he knows about the time loop, or at least probably knows enough about it to know that Zhao Yunlan is going to be pretty friendly about Dixing people later on. (Or several millennia earlier, or whatever.) Given that he met Kunlun first, I feel like he should be surprised by Zhao Yunlan not empathizing with Dixing people from the start. Shen Wei seems really sincere here, though, so I don't know. Maybe he really doesn't know how the time loop is going to work, and was never sure Zhao Yunlan could be won over to care about Dixingren?

Or maybe it's just that he's been living for so long in circumstances where he either a) couldn't talk about Dixing at all, or b) could only talk about Dixingren as Scientifically Fascinating Monsters Oddities, that finally having Zhao Yunlan begin to resemble the (more empathetic) Kunlun he remembers is such a relief that it's a bit overwhelming for Shen Wei, and prompts the comment.

[trobadora]

Yes, that's such an interesting question about people with Dixing genes! Of course Lai Su might also be full Dixingren, just adopted or something, and never knew his own heritage. But I like the idea that there are people around who are both, and I don't think the Guardian Treaty or the Envoy's mandate accounts for them at all ...

[grayswandir]

Of course Lai Su might also be full Dixingren

Ah, that's a good point. Somehow I just took it for granted that saying he "had Dixing genes" was distinct from saying he was fully Dixingren, since I don't think anyone else ever uses this phrasing to describe anyone from Dixing, but now that you mention it, the fact that he himself didn't know about it could be the explanation for the different phrasing.

I just checked the Chinese to see if it would offer any clues, but in this case the English translation is pretty much exactly literal: 来苏肯定拥有地星人的基因而他自己不知道, "Lai Su must have possessed Dixing genes and himself did not know it." Which as far as I can tell is just as ambiguous in Chinese as in English as to whether it suggests the possibility of being part-Dixingren-part-human or not. So. Hmm. Given that apparently a lot of Dixingren develop their powers late or even never, there certainly could be Dixingren who were born and raised on the surface who live their entire lives without ever even finding out they're not human. Which is also interesting. So I guess, food for thought either way!

[trobadora]

Yeah, the phrasing is ambiguous, but it has interesting worldbuilding implications either way!

[nnozomi]

I am trying to come up with a useful response to your very thoughtful discussion, but 90% of my brain is just sitting there going oh my God look at their faces. Thank you for the lovely screencaps of all those expressions. (Also I love the unintentional ? translator's pun on "characters," nice catch.)

I feel like, very broadly, a lot of the conversation (as highlighted by your questions) is about things happening beyond individual control--Zhao Yunlan has moved beyond "Dixingren are bad people and/or monsters who do bad things" to "there's a bigger picture and we don't always have a choice about where we are in it," leading him to empathy with Dixingren in some cases.

I do think he suspects that something is up with Shen Wei and Dixing, whether he has figured out for certain that Shen Wei is Dixingren or just as ideas, but he's convinced by this time that Shen Wei is closely associated with Dixing in some way. And Shen Wei is kind of struggling between falling back into complete trust of Zhao Yunlan, his earliest instinct and where he'd like to be, and maintaining his learned barriers of privacy and secrecy (like the intimate liniment scene immediately followed by the silly bears thing, if I'm remembering right).

Zhao Yunlan's little finger-wave and laugh are, I think, his standard lowering-tension mannerisms--he's making his "I never thought this day would come myself" line less dramatic, less of a big deal (or attempting to). With no evidence whatsoever, I think Shen Wei's reaction is because these are very typical Zhao Yunlan-isms, and the Zhao Yunlan in front of him just completely overlapped with the Kunlun in his head and he's overwhelmed.

anyway, lovely writeup!

also, I realized that when I'm talking to someone at their desk I have a habit of picking up something on it and playing with it too...but I would draw the line at eating their cake, jeez.

[trobadora]

With no evidence whatsoever, I think Shen Wei's reaction is because these are very typical Zhao Yunlan-isms, and the Zhao Yunlan in front of him just completely overlapped with the Kunlun in his head and he's overwhelmed.

Awwww! :D

[nnozomi]

I mean, you guys have come up with much more well-thought-out and plausible suggestions here, so I'm not holding to this theory. but look at his face.

[trobadora]

Both! All of the above!

His face, indeed. :D

[imashoe]

This is a great scene, and I really enjoyed reading your recap of it.

1. Why does Shen Wei ask Zhao Yunlan if Lai Su reaped what he sowed? What kind of answer, if any, does he expect (or want) from Zhao Yunlan?

These are great questions, although I'm not decided on my answers. Shen Wei is basically asking Zhao Yunlan's opinion on Lai Su's culpability, which is a difficult subject by its very nature, but made more complicated by all the layers in their conversation. It is an efficient way to get a sort of understanding of Zhao Yunlan's opinion re. Dixingren though.

2. There are some obvious meta meanings to Zhao Yunlan's "the two of us right now might be characters in someone's book." What's Zhao Yunlan's meaning? And why is Shen Wei so moved by it?

My interpretation of this is in line with what nnozomi says above. This part touches on how much of one's life is predetermined by factors outside of one's control. A lot of their conversation has to do with how much autonomy characters have outside of the author's control, both literally, in the case of Lai Su, and figuratively. It's possible that this line makes Shen Wei think about the time loop. After all, there's a certain aspect to the time loop that is about being constrained by circumstances.

3. When Shen Wei opens up and tells him he never expected Zhao Yunlan to say these things, what does Zhao Yunlan's reaction (with the laugh) mean? What does Shen Wei think after that reaction?

I think Shen Wei's words, that he never would have expected Zhao Yunlan to empathize with Dixingren, can be read as a criticism of Zhao Yunlan's attitude towards Dixingren, and Zhao Yunlan's response actually reads to me as a sort of self-deprecating acceptance of the validity of that criticism. It works to defuse tension and to acknowledge that Shen Wei has a point.

4. Does Zhao Yunlan know (as opposed to suspect) by now that Shen Wei is Dixingren? If so, what does this mean for Shen Wei? If he's still trying to hide that he's Dixingren, isn't he giving it away with what he says about Zhao Yunlan empathizing with the plight of Dixingren (and how he says it)? Or is giving it away Shen Wei's intention?

I'd say that at this point Zhao Yunlan must suspect Shen Wei of being Dixingren. As for Shen Wei, I don't think he's consciously trying to give it away. And to be fair, his in at the SID has always been his knowledge of Dixingren, so his talking like this is perhaps not that suspicious in itself.

[trobadora]

It is an efficient way to get a sort of understanding of Zhao Yunlan's opinion re. Dixingren though.

Yes, this!

A lot of their conversation has to do with how much autonomy characters have outside of the author's control, both literally, in the case of Lai Su, and figuratively. It's possible that this line makes Shen Wei think about the time loop.

Ooh, yes, that is such a good thought. That has to be on his mind, especially with Zhao Yunlan changing before his eyes and becoming more like the Kunlun he knew. ♥

[imashoe]

That has to be on his mind, especially with Zhao Yunlan changing before his eyes and becoming more like the Kunlun he knew. ♥

It's always on my mind, so why not his? But seriously, yes, the way Zhao Yunlan is changing and showing more sympathy towards Dixingren has to contribute to any thoughts Shen Wei has about the time loop.

[trobadora]

It's always on my mind, so why not his?

Hahaha, you and me both. :D

[trobadora]

This is a great post! I love all the details you point out.

I think it's Shen Wei's ink brush

Oh, yes, absolutely, it never occurred to me that it might not be! And as you say, it fits perfectly with Zhao Yunlan's behaviour elsewhere.

I think the way Shen Wei is dressed supports the reading that it's late at night – he's just working by himself, not expecting students or anything. (Which makes it all the more interesting that Zhao Yunlan comes to visit him there!)

The Chinese used is 角色 (jué sè) = character, role, part. I

Oh! This is interesting – my pop-up dictionary says there are two readings for those characters: juésè (role), and jiǎosè (persona, character in a novel). Zhao Yunlan says “juésè” ...

Their scenes in this episode prior to this one contain Zhao Yunlan pursuing & trying to get information from Shen Wei. This scene doesn't.

This is such a good observation! And agreed, it's such a good little scene for showing them actually becoming friends, beyond the cat-and-mouse game they're playing. ♥

1. Why does Shen Wei ask Zhao Yunlan if Lai Su reaped what he sowed? What kind of answer, if any, does he expect (or want) from Zhao Yunlan?

I think there are two sides to this. On a practical level, he's probably asking if Lai Su was responsible for everything by himself, or if someone else was involved. (We know Zhu Jiu was involved, but I think neither Shen Wei nor Zhao Yunlan do.) But also, Shen Wei is asking how Zhao Yunlan judges someone who literally created a monster with his superpowers. I think he's feeling out his attitudes towards Dixingren again ... but this time he gets a better answer than he'd hoped for: actual sympathy towards Dixingren.

I think at this point Shen Wei had resigned himself to being patient, and expected it to take some time for Zhao Yunlan to come around to a more positive view of Dixingren – and now it's happening much sooner than expected.

2. There are some obvious meta meanings to Zhao Yunlan's "the two of us right now might be characters in someone's book." What's Zhao Yunlan's meaning? And why is Shen Wei so moved by it?

I agree with nnozomi and imashoe above – I think it's about autonomy. He's jokingly acknowledging that there are larger forces at play. And that awareness also changes how Zhao Yunlan judges Dixingren. IMO it's that whole context and Zhao Yunlan's entire speech that moves Shen Wei, not just this last bit.

3. When Shen Wei opens up and tells him he never expected Zhao Yunlan to say these things, what does Zhao Yunlan's reaction (with the laugh) mean? What does Shen Wei think after that reaction?

He's being self-deprecating. Acknowledging that Shen Wei's implied criticism of his previous attitude towards Dixingren is justified – that he wouldn't have thought like that before, and would have been wrong – while also trying to not make a big deal about it. Maybe in part because he's embarrassed?

4. Does Zhao Yunlan know (as opposed to suspect) by now that Shen Wei is Dixingren? If so, what does this mean for Shen Wei? If he's still trying to hide that he's Dixingren, isn't he giving it away with what he says about Zhao Yunlan empathizing with the plight of Dixingren (and how he says it)? Or is giving it away Shen Wei's intention?

Shen Wei has been pushing something similar since the start, ever since his "do you really think Dixingren are so different from us" speech in episode 1. I don't think his strong feeling here gives away much more than he's already given away, and he's not trying very hard to hide anything. Zhao Yunlan by this point must suspect pretty strongly that he's Dixingren himself, but I don't think he's entirely sure. Shen Wei might just be an ally. But where Shen Wei's sympathies lie hasn't been in question for him, I don't think.

[cyberbrain]

Oh my! Episode 7 is when I officially got hooked on this show. I wrote a post about that here (it's mainly about the liniment scene and this one).

either Shen Wei changed his clothes during the day, or Zhao Yunlan hasn't changed his clothes in over a day.
Huh? *rewatches* You're right! And yes, there is a night feel to the scene—the university is very empty and quiet but also the scenes preceding this one are night scenes and it's implied this one is happening alongside the others. So re: Shen Wei's outfit, it could be that this is just a different day but now that I'm thinking about this, I'd rather believe he changed his clothes during the day. It would explain why Zhao Yunlan is still in testing-Shen-Wei mode. (Since he saw him earlier that day, it's suspicious that Shen Wei, who was supposedly in the university the entire time, had a random outfit change. Whether he's suspecting Shen Wei of being the Envoy or just a simple Dixingren is a harder to answer question.)

1. Why does Shen Wei ask Zhao Yunlan if Lai Su reaped what he sowed? What kind of answer, if any, does he expect (or want) from Zhao Yunlan?
IMO, they're both testing each other in this scene. Shen Wei met Kunlun again in episode 1 and was deeply disappointed to find him so different (in a bad way). I think he hoped at first that maybe Kunlun was pretending—probably to hide their shared past or possibly something else—but saw that wasn't the case. Zhao Yunlan wasn't his Kunlun and that hurt. Zhao Yunlan might not have hated Dixingren those like Shen Wei but he actively disliked them.

(I'm of the opinion that Lai Su is half-Dixingren half-Haixingren.) So when it came to Lai Su, who was objectively a victim of his own circumstances, Shen Wei wanted to test Zhao Yunlan because he's still hoping he can get Kunlun back. He wants empathy or at least some minimal understanding from Zhao Yunlan.

(It's not clear to me when Shen Wei became aware of the timeloop. It could've been before the events of the show, but it doesn't really seem like it to me. Maybe he's got an idea about it by now and is only realizing it could be true in this scene.)

2. There are some obvious meta meanings to Zhao Yunlan's "the two of us right now might be characters in someone's book." What's Zhao Yunlan's meaning? And why is Shen Wei so moved by it?
Oof, people here have given some very nice answers. Meanwhile, I always saw this scene as comic relief, a bit of fourth wall breaking to acknowledge the novel. :D

My replies to questions 3 and 4 got linked together, oops.

I agree that Zhao Yunlan is being self-deprecating there. Both of their immediate reactions are interesting here, though—Shen Wei realizes that he's probably said too much just as Zhao Yunlan falls silent and gets that calculating look on his face.

I think Shen Wei is still testing in a way. He doesn't want to *tell* Zhao Yunlan—he wants him to know already like Kunlun knew. However, if somehow Zhao Yunlan doesn't, then Shen Wei also doesn't want him to know. Basically, he just wants his Kunlun without potentially putting him in danger!! ;(

So maybe Shen Wei is glad to have shared this thought with Zhao Yunlan, to have praised him for his newfound empathy toward Dixingren but then regrets it when Zhao Yunlan rephrases the Envoy's words from episode 1 at him: "要变天了 [The weather is changing.]" turns into Zhao Yunlan's: "我总觉得呀...龙城的阴雨时刻要到了 [Overall, I think rain is coming to Dragon City.]" (Punctuation in the original added by me. Those are my own translations, I tried to keep them as literal as possible. Anyone, feel free to point out any mistakes.) In the post I linked, I've connected those two sentences to Zhao Yunlan suspecting Shen Wei of being the Envoy but that doesn't need to be the case. If Zhao Yunlan has just solidified his suspicion that Shen Wei is Dixingren, he could be testing his reaction toward something the Envoy said. Of course, if Shen Wei isn't the Envoy, he has no way to know that those are his words but still, that sentence, coming out of Zhao Yunlan's mouth, would sound like a threat to a Dixingren, I feel.

[trickytricky]

Ah, this is such a great scene and you called out all the best moments in it! And there’s been so much thoughtful commentary already, I've loved reading all the fascinating insights everyone has.

Just to throw in some more food for thought, the line where Shen Wei starts getting emotional, where you have the translation as: "I never thought that I'd hear you say something like this." The translation team on Viki worded it a little differently, as Shen Wei saying “I never would’ve thought that you would say those words to me today.”

I can’t speak to the translation choices or original language implications, but the Viki translation wording definitely led me down the path of thinking he was referring back to the conversation they’d had earlier that day rather than *just* the words Zhao Yunlan said directly in the conversation there. This is the first time they’re speaking again since they closed out the bear!mugshots video call (I dearly love that scene so, so, so much and how much *fun* Shen Wei is having at the beginning of it), which had ended up closing on first an awkward, but then reversing into a surprisingly positive note on Zhao Yunlan’s part where his anti-Dixing attitudes had burst out a little, but then got deliberately reeled back. So, Shen Wei getting emotional here I read as definitely being centered around Zhao Yunlan’s attitudes towards Dixing people changing to become less prejudiced and hostile.

Starting at around 16:15 earlier in that episode as they were wrapping up the video call, they had an exchange:
Shen Wei says, “I keep having a feeling that the dead victim and his friend don’t have the qualities of a Dixingren.”

And Zhao Yunlan responded quickly with, “So what are the qualities of a Dixingren?”

I personally read a hint of hostility in Zhao Yunlan’s tone here suddenly, his voice got a little colder in a conversation that up until then had been pretty light-hearted and very friendly on his side…and it’s in response to Shen Wei saying that the victim and his friend, violent muggers, struck him as not-Dixingren-like, to which Zhao Yunlan’s *instinctive* response was to snap back and challenge. Shen Wei ducks his head, says nothing, is clearly uncomfortable with the quick uptick in hostility/confrontational direction Zhao Yunlan suddenly took. But, then there’s this exchange:



Zhao Yunlan clearly immediately regrets what he said, and he understands that his own biases really jumped out in the open there for a second when his instinctive response was to get a little bit hostile at someone who mildly suggested that two people who were criminals *didn’t* seem to share defining qualities that he automatically associated with Dixingren. “Okay,” he says, “I won’t keep making you feel awkward. I have seen a number of Dixingren now; it’s always that most are evil, few are kind. Rest assured, I surely will not lump them under one head.” (I think his statement of not wanting to make Shen Wei feel awkward would work equally well to cover his bases either way, both with Zhao Yunlan strongly suspecting Shen Wei was Dixingren himself by then as well as that he understood his statement would have come across as blatantly prejudiced against a group of people Shen Wei clearly felt sympathetic towards even if he *wasn’t* Dixingren himself…) Regardless, he could see the wrongness in what he’d blurted out and wanted to convey that he was going to get that sentiment under control.

I think him being willing to walk that back at all, being able to recognize his own prejudice and give assurances that he wouldn’t let that kind of bias poison his view of all Dixingren meant a lot to Shen Wei and he recognized that it signaled a significant change in his attitude…but then they had to end the call and the next time they have a chance to speak is during the scene you re-capped, so Shen Wei's emotional response later that night is folding in the contents of both conversations.

[trobadora]

I dearly love that scene so, so, so much and how much *fun* Shen Wei is having at the beginning of it

Yes, me too! BEARS. :D

And yeah, that's such a good point about the previous scene, and the way the dynamic changes there from Shen Wei having fun trolling Zhao Yunlan with bears to the sudden heavy topic of attitudes towards Dixingren. Their previous conversation absolutely informs the later one.

I think I read the way this plays out slightly differently from you - Zhao Yunlan tries to make it better when he says he won't lump all Dixingren together, but in fact he still says most are evil and few are kind. And that's ... still not very good. So when Shen Wei later asks him about Lai Su, perhaps part of what he means is, "So, do you think he was evil? because he for sure wasn't kind." And Zhao Yunlan surprises him by being willing to see more nuance this time.

[trickytricky]

Fair enough, and the line is ambiguous enough that there's definitely room to read it like that. I just hear it much less as Zhao Yunlan 'still say[ing] most [Dixingren] are evil and few are kind', as some kind of general condemnation applicable to all of them as a people at this point in his character development, but that the comment was more literal in a sense, and the words he said directly before that are key... that he has "seen a number of Dixingren by now"... so he's acknowledging that it's been his reality that up to that point, of those he's had an opportunity to interact with in his position, most of those individuals, that he's seen in his lived experience, have been evil and few kind. Then the follow up line about not lumping all Dixingren together in judgment establishes that he now understands that attitude reflects that he'd previously been judging a whole people based on an unfair sample and he knows it.

I think that's how Shen Wei hears it, too. To me, it just makes a little less sense that Shen Wei is so happy about what he'd heard Zhao Yunlan say earlier in the day, in combination with what he heard him say in that end conversation, if those earlier lines were meant to be understood as Zhao Yunlan doubling down on anti-Dixingren attitudes, that he still considered 'most evil and few kind' applicable to them as a whole people.

[trobadora]

if those earlier lines were meant to be understood as Zhao Yunlan doubling down on anti-Dixingren attitudes

That's not how I meant it! Sorry if I expressed it poorly. It was absolutely a step forward for Zhao Yunlan. But what he says about Lai Su later goes way beyond that, and comes so fast after this, I think it makes sense Shen Wei is so very touched by it.