sid_guardian | The Art of Dialogue and the kitchen knife scene

Entry tags:

The Art of Dialogue and the kitchen knife scene

I was watching a YouTube video about how to write snappy dialogue (banter) by

heyjameshurst. The creator used examples from The Princess Bride, The Empire Strikes Back, His Girl Friday, and The West Wing to illustrate that good dialogue is like a tennis match, a playful competition, and in each volley the tension escalates to "a sudden, sharp reveal of truth."

Afterwards, I was thinking about it in terms of Guardian, and the first scene that came to mind was the kitchen knife scene. Wow, this is a stellar example of what the video talked about! It's dynamic because every line fires back in a way that is difficult for the other person to respond to. (Often they're reacting to the subtext -- or actually, what they perceive the other's subtext to be -- rather than the words, and sometimes slightly at cross-purposes, so lines that could be non-sequiturs feel seamless.) And the truth is forced out of them. It's so impressive!

ZYL: I woke up because I was hungry.
SW: *turns and drops the knife*
ZYL: *strides over and grabs his wrist* Don't you think of lying to me. What did you do in order to heal my eyes?
SW: *starts to leave*
ZYL: You used the Longevity Dial.
SW: *stops*
ZYL: *moves to his side* You shared your life force with mine. You used your power to neutralize the corrosion of my body. Am I right?
SW: My... My... My body's energy structure has suffered a severe blow. I need to exchange all my energy.
ZYL: It must hurt a lot.
SW: *ghastly smile* Fortunately... Fortunately, I'm used to getting injured.
ZYL: I do not deserve what you are doing for me.
SW: You're worth it.
ZYL: *explodes* Then, what do you want me to do? Be indebted to you? To bow to you? You are not immortal! Why should I so casually owe you a life?
SW: This life is what I'm returning to you.
ZYL: ??????
SW: You should rest soon.

There are so many truths here!! <3 <3 <3

Thinking about it also made me realise something about Shen Wei's initially trying to leave and his "Fortunately, I'm used to getting injured" line, which I will explain in six screencaps:

Zhao Yunlan sitting miserably in the gutter, waving Shen Wei away.

Zhao Yunlan sitting miserably in the gutter, waving Shen Wei away.

Zhao Yunlan admitting he's incapacitated by an old stomach ache.

Zhao Yunlan trying to laugh off his latest Hallows-induced collapse.

Zhao Yunlan grinning as he says he feels dizzy a lot.

Shen Wei saying "Fortunately" to a tense Zhao Yunlan.

Shen Wei's ghastly smile as he says that he's used to getting injured.

Newsflash, Shen Wei: Zhao Yunlan's tactics are no more reassuring or less infuriating when you try them.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

But just because I think SW is right, dosen't mean it's reassuring, because there's nothing reassuring about having been hurt/injured often enough that you're used to it, even if you CAN handle it perfectly fine.

Idk, I do find that reassuring. Getting hurt in the line of duty is something that happens. SW has healing powers. (We see that with the Shadow Man.) I don't think "avoidance of necessary suffering" is a priority for either of them, and that's okay? He has plenty of good things in his life too -- all the flavours, just like Kunlun promised him!

and there's no way to pay it back (not that SW would want that), and what does that make him? What does that mean for them? That has to be part of why he's lashing out at SW and (rhetorically) asking what he's expecting in return.

Yes! He's like "I don't understand what our relationship is to you, and YOU WON'T TELL ME!"

OT, but I'm always very aware during "This life is what I'm returning to you" of the differential between the personal costs of "shot some bad guys from a safe distant position" and "actual energy exchange that is burning through his energy structure" -- so I have to read the "life" as about more than just the narrow definition of helping SW survive that first YOHE battle. I think the "life" ZYL gave SW was hope-at-a-time-of-extreme-hopelessness and connection and love and fighting-at-his-side. And SW in return is giving ZYL self-care and his sight back and connection and love and fighting-at-his-side.

ETA: that he's been given this gift-sacrifice (great term) and he can't/won't turn it down, and there's no way to pay it back (not that SW would want that), and what does that make him?

And also: his literal title is Guardian. He is supposed to be the one protecting people!!

Edited 2025-04-26 22:34 (UTC)

Idk, I do find that reassuring. Getting hurt in the line of duty is something that happens. SW has healing powers. (We see that with the Shadow Man.) I don't think "avoidance of necessary suffering" is a priority for either of them, and that's okay?

I agree with everything you say, except that I don't think it's reassuring. Possibly we mean different things by "reassuring"? LOL. I mean, I just don't think the existence of such a thing as "necessary suffering" is reassuring in general. It's a fact, but that doesn't mean it doesn't suck, even if it's happened before, will happen again, and isn't that big of a deal in the larger scheme of things. And it's no great comfort for anyone (ZYL) who's watching someone they love who's suffering, either.

(Aside: also, SW isn't saying "I'm going to be fine" - if he did, that would probably be a bit more reassuring for ZYL! He's saying, "I can handle this", which he can - but handling this, here, involves a contingency plan where he turns himself into a bomb, and so he's not promising to be fine.)

I think the "life" ZYL gave SW was hope-at-a-time-of-extreme-hopelessness and connection and love and fighting-at-his-side. And SW in return is giving ZYL self-care and his sight back and connection and love and fighting-at-his-side.

Yes! ♥ ♥ ♥

"I mean, I just don't think the existence of such a thing as "necessary suffering" is reassuring in general. It's a fact, but that doesn't mean it doesn't suck, even if it's happened before, will happen again, and isn't that big of a deal in the larger scheme of things. And it's no great comfort for anyone (ZYL) who's watching someone they love who's suffering, either."

Yeah, ITA on all of this, I couldn't have said better myself.

ETA: Damn, I just continue having extra feelings and thoughts when I think I'm finished. xD

"Aside: also, SW isn't saying "I'm going to be fine" - if he did, that would probably be a bit more reassuring for ZYL! He's saying, "I can handle this", which he can - but handling this, here, involves a contingency plan where he turns himself into a bomb, and so he's not promising to be fine."

I find this lack of promise both worse (because he can't promise to be fine) and better (because it means that he means everything else, it's not just empty words).

Edited 2025-04-27 07:12 (UTC)

♥ ♥ ♥

I find this lack of promise both worse (because he can't promise to be fine) and better (because it means that he means everything else, it's not just empty words).

YESSSSSS, 100% this! He's not giving fake reassurances; what he says, he fully means.

From further upthread:
And it's upsetting to Zhao Yunlan in particular because he (of course!) wants them to be good to and for each other, and here he is just another item in the long list of things that have hurt Shen Wei. Which is the absolute last thing he wants to be!

I'm not sure about the "wants them to be good to and for each other" at this stage? I think it's more that ZYL wants to be free to sacrifice himself, but it pushes all his childhood-trauma buttons if anyone else does the same, and especially someone as important to him as Shen Wei.

Possibly we mean different things by "reassuring"? LOL.

Ha, it seems like we are! I didn't mean comforting; I was talking about reassurance in the "will be fine" sense (which is actually false reassurance, but neither ZYL nor the first-time viewer knows that yet). I think SW's saying, "Fortunately, I'm used to being injured," strongly implies that this is like those other injuries, ie, not permanent or debilitating in anything more than the short-term. And that's reassuring to me, because it makes me feel like SW is a) strong enough, and b) later, when we find he hasn't healed himself, that was a choice.

But you're right, that's not the same as comforting. Nothing is going to comfort ZYL in this moment; he's inadvertently caused Shen Wei suffering, and there's nothing he can do except offer sympathy, which is not enough. And Shen Wei's ghastly smile is even rejecting that much -- he doesn't want sympathy or comfort. His first instinct was to leave. He won't let ZYL share this, which makes it worse. (Versus the bench scene, where Shen Wei asks for what he wants (to rest in the sun) and lets ZYL stay with him, and they share the comfort together.)

I mean, I just don't think the existence of such a thing as "necessary suffering" is reassuring in general.

True! I should have put a paragraph break before that sentence, or parentheses or something. My bad!

I'm not sure about the "wants them to be good to and for each other" at this stage? I think it's more that ZYL wants to be free to sacrifice himself, but it pushes all his childhood-trauma buttons if anyone else does the same, and especially someone as important to him as Shen Wei.

No, at this point I think he's definitely there - he just told his father about SW being genuinely good to him, and you can't tell me he doesn't want to reciprocate. Also, IMO at this point in time he's not thinking in terms of self-sacrifice - he still thinks they can win this. I don't think he thinks the situation will get so dire as to require a sacrifice until after he gets slapped in the face with the cost to SW; before that, he thinks the Sundial exchange was an unqualified win, and why shouldn't they have another?

I was talking about reassurance in the "will be fine" sense

Oh, right! Though like I said, SW is (IMO very deliberately) not saying he'll be fine, only that he can handle it.

But I agree that it matters IMMENSELY that SW is strong enough, and that what he ultimately does with the white energy is his choice, because he can not only handle it, but make it into an opportunity he wouldn't otherwise have had. Which I love! A lot! And actually, you know, that part I find immensely reassuring myself, so I guess I'm talking myself round to your POV now, LOL.

And Shen Wei's ghastly smile is even rejecting that much -- he doesn't want sympathy or comfort.

Yes, very good point! ZYL tries to offer sympathy with "it must hurt a lot", but SW essentially waves that off with that smile and the "used to it" line.

No, at this point I think he's definitely there - he just told his father about SW being genuinely good to him, and you can't tell me he doesn't want to reciprocate. Also, IMO at this point in time he's not thinking in terms of self-sacrifice - he still thinks they can win this.

Oh, you're right. Good point! (But I still think ZYL is expecting the job will kill him one day, like he tells Zhu Hong in the street. He's still wired to throw himself in the line of fire at the drop of a hat. So he either thinks Shen Wei will live on without him (ie, hasn't applied the "do you think I could be okay without you?" corollary in both directions), or he hasn't confronted the contradiction there at all... which may be necessary for him to continue to do his job.)

Though like I said, SW is (IMO very deliberately) not saying he'll be fine, only that he can handle it.

He's strongly implying it, imo. ;-p If he didn't look so weak and grey, he might even have been convincing.

But I agree that it matters IMMENSELY that SW is strong enough, and that what he ultimately does with the white energy is his choice, because he can not only handle it, but make it into an opportunity he wouldn't otherwise have had. Which I love! A lot!

YES!!!!

And actually, you know, that part I find immensely reassuring myself, so I guess I'm talking myself round to your POV now, LOL.

*wins* :D :D :D (And oh, I just realised! The blindness was from Ye Zun's attack, and Shen Wei manages to belatedly pay it back to Ye Zun a hundredfold. Which means Ye Zun is the root cause of his own destruction! THIS SHOW!!! <333)

So he either thinks Shen Wei will live on without him (ie, hasn't applied the "do you think I could be okay without you?" corollary in both directions), or he hasn't confronted the contradiction there at all...

I think a little bit of both, probably.

Which means Ye Zun is the root cause of his own destruction! THIS SHOW!!! <333

Ooh yes, I hadn't thought about it in those terms before, but you're totally right! THIS SHOW!!!! :D

I think a little bit of both, probably.

I think so, too.

Ooh yes, I hadn't thought about it in those terms before, but you're totally right! THIS SHOW!!!! :D

:D :D :D

"And oh, I just realised! The blindness was from Ye Zun's attack, and Shen Wei manages to belatedly pay it back to Ye Zun a hundredfold. Which means Ye Zun is the root cause of his own destruction! THIS SHOW!!! <333"

Okay, this is COOL AF. ~~Ye Zun, just don't blind people and you're gonna be fine. xD xD~~

:D :D :D :D :D

"He has plenty of good things in his life too -- all the flavours, just like Kunlun promised him!"

Aw, I love this! ♡ (I don't need to like that the bad things are happening to like this. :D) And obviously Kunlun was right because he has already seen it, which only makes it even better to me.

"I think the "life" ZYL gave SW was hope-at-a-time-of-extreme-hopelessness and connection and love and fighting-at-his-side. And SW in return is giving ZYL self-care and his sight back and connection and love and fighting-at-his-side."

♡♡♡ ITA! I never even really considered the literal aspect of it, I just skipped right to this.

And obviously Kunlun was right because he has already seen it, which only makes it even better to me.

EXCELLENT point. This is my absolute favourite thing about Guardian, the way things loop around between them and they each are a crucial part of what lets the other become the person they know.

Yessss. ♡♡♡ I feel like it must be one of the most personal time loops EVER, and it's so beautiful how them just existing and learning from each other is the thing that makes it work, it doesn't need anything else. :)

just existing and learning from each other

YES!!!! That's the best part! :D

Yessss! ZYL time-travelled TEN THOUSAND YEARS to sit in the moonlight with Shen Wei and feed him lollipops. <3 <3 <3

and it's so beautiful how them just existing and learning from each other is the thing that makes it work, it doesn't need anything else. :)

That's such a lovely way to put it. <33333

"ZYL time-travelled TEN THOUSAND YEARS to sit in the moonlight with Shen Wei and feed him lollipops. <3 <3 <3"

Asdfghjhgfdshjsdfgfdkl;; ♡♡♡ I'M DECEASED WITH GLEE. xD :D :D

I've been writing a YOHE fic again btw, I thought I ran out of those and I was kinda sad about it ngl, but apparently not. :D :D

Edited (typo!) 2025-04-29 11:14 (UTC)

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject

no subject