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sid_guardian2020-06-06 09:55 am
nnozomi) wrote in sid_guardian2020-06-06 09:55 am
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Focus on Zhao Xinci: I don’t want you to die stupid!
[Drama only below, because I haven’t read the novel; please mark drama vs novel as needed in comments. Also, I’m sorry this is so wordy; believe me, it started out MUCH longer.]
Who he is
Zhao Xinci is the Director of the Xingdu Bureau, the first chief of the SID, Zhao Yunlan’s estranged father, Shen Xi’s widower, and a reluctant headspace-sharer with Zhang Shi. In his field agent days he shared his son’s propensities for denim jackets and comfort over formality; as a senior bureaucrat he dresses like a dandy to rival Shen Wei (can I have a small fic about the two of them running into each other while purchasing ascots, please?) and favors a purple coat Zhu Jiu would envy. He is either Minister Gao’s direct superior, or has the upper hand anyway due to a long history of working together, greater competence, and a stronger personality.
After becoming the first SID chief, Zhao Xinci became more and more absorbed in his work, inflicting lasting damage on his relationship with his wife Shen Xi and their son, to which the coup de grâce was the death of Shen Xi as a hostage in the hands of Dixingren criminals. This (according to Zhang Shi) turned Zhao Xinci’s general law-enforcement dislike of Dixingren into an active obsession with putting down Dixingren criminals.
After a complex and tortuous path through the second half of the series, he ends up as part of an excellent triumvirate with Guo Ying and Li Qian, supporting the SID in extremis and providing competence, compassion, and smarts in administration as of the epilogue.
What he’s like
Zhao Xinci is a fascinating character: complex and ambiguous, ruthless but not beyond empathy, capable but lacking some of his son’s crucial skills, on the wrong side often but not necessarily a bad guy, inflexible but not humorless. He thinks on the fly almost as well as his son, but is much less inclined to change his behavior accordingly. Competence and efficiency are his watchwords; in episode 16 he reels off Guo Changcheng’s personal information effortlessly from memory, and assigns each SID member an investigative task suited to their specialties (including willingness to make use of Da Qing as a Yashou). He is not unwilling to shoot to kill, but not without provocation; he considers the Guardian Writ to back up the death penalty. He tends to follow the letter of the law where Zhao Yunlan is more likely to be concerned with the moral right of the matter. Zhao Yunlan notes, distinguishing him from Zhang Shi, that he’s a pragmatist with no concern for larger moral issues.
(He also has an incongruous name: 心慈, heart’s mercy, almost feminine (help me out, proper Chinese speakers?) and certainly far gentler than you would expect from a man of his demeanor.)
Two for the price of one
Zhao Xinci has shared his head with the Dixingren Zhang Shi for the last twenty years or so. Although initially promising “I won’t control you or take you over,” Zhang Shi tends to speak up in his host’s person at essential moments to soften Zhao Xinci’s approach to the SID and Dixing, but his ultimate morality is, to put it kindly, questionable. Zhao Xinci does give his consent to having Zhang Shi live more or less rent-free in his head, but it’s a) after the fact and b) very much a case of “we can do this the easy way or we can do this the hard way, up to you” (Zhang Shi implies that Zhao Xinci could hurt himself by trying to expel ZS forcibly, and ZXC has just seen ZS’s last host kill himself after “intermittent psychosis.”). Zhao Xinci, a pragmatist if ever there was one, accepts that he’s screwed and makes the best of it by getting ZS to provide Dixingren support for his work. It’s implied that ZXC’s mental cohabitation with Zhang Shi was actively bad for his health, with Zhang Shi’s activities as a source of cardiac stress leading to his emergency surgery on Reunion Night.
Notable moments
In Zhao Xinci’s conversation about his involvement with the superpower serum with Shen Wei (a bravura exercise in expressing large emotions through subdued restraint on both parts) he refers ominously to “protecting…the one both of us care about,” implying that a) he loves his son, and b) he knows Shen Wei does too (based on Zhao Yunlan’s defiant “He’s good to me” when he’s blind?).
In episode 29, we see a younger Zhao Xinci giving little!Zhao Yunlan instructions on proper investigation: an interesting combination of dad’s mania for efficiency with something of his son’s empathy. However, modern-day Zhao Xinci on his son: “that brat,” Zhao Yunlan on his father: “that old jerk.” When Zhao Yunlan offers on the rooftop to give his life in his father’s place, Zhao Xinci responds with dizzying venom, rendering his son completely speechless for almost the only time in forty episodes, even though he may know it’s not exactly true. When he can catch his breath, Zhao Yunlan retorts “I’m not like you. Instead of having regrets for twenty years, I’ll follow my heart [the advice younger!Zhao Xinci gave him] in the first place. Let me tell you that a sacrifice for family is worth it!” (consciously quoting Shen Wei?)
In episode 38, ZXC and ZS get a heroic entrance in time to help Zhao Yunlan overcome Professor Ouyang. Zhao Yunlan and his father get one last hug before the former heads off to Dixing, and Zhang Shi helpfully twists the knife: “How did it feel to hug your son? You’ve waited twenty years.” Zhao Xinci basically tells him to fuck off and I’m sorry to say I can’t blame him.
After forming a battlefield alliance with Li Qian and the patient Guo Ying to support Zhao Yunlan and the SID, Zhao Xinci fights with the Yashou in the big messy struggle of episodes 39 and 40. Sending Lao Chu, Zhu Hong, and Da Qing off to Dixing, ZXC tells them that it’s an honor for his son to have them as colleagues, a major admission for the prejudiced Zhao Xinci to make to two Yashou and a Dixingren. He provides Da Qing with the serum which will be a key part of defeating Ye Zun.
In episode 40, we see ZXC thriving, still in purple, along with Minister Guo and Director Li. A flashback shows him explaining the Lantern sacrifice to Zhao Yunlan, with an excruciating instant of silence between father and son in which Zhao Yunlan understands and accepts that he may be the one to step into the Lantern, and Zhao Xinci turns away from him in pain. Zhao Yunlan asks him to promise that if it does happen, Zhang Shi will step in for him and live his life well, Zhao Xinci accepts, and they have a horribly awkward, tearful hug. It could be that this is all Zhang Shi here, given “how did it feel to hug your son?” later on, but I really hope not.
Discussion questions
1. What are the similarities and differences between Zhao Xinci and his son?
2. How did Zhao Xinci and Zhang Shi interact over the years? Did they learn from one another? Was Zhao Xinci resigned to having Zhang Shi in his head forever, or what? What did Zhang Shi think of Zhao Xinci? (If Zhao Yunlan had actually shot him with the dark-energy gun, would it have killed ZS without harming ZXC, or what?)
3. What is Zhao Xinci’s relationship with Da Qing in particular? We talk a lot about Zhao Yunlan having been raised by cats; Da Qing and Zhao Xinci “worked together for ten years”—from the time the SID was founded, when Zhao Yunlan was, what, eight or nine on? How did ZXC and DQ get along?
4. Do we ever find out what “Xingdu” is anyway, as in the Xingdu Bureau? It looks like the hanzi are 星督, basically “planetary supervisory/Haixing Supervisory,” which is helpfully vague.
5. When does Zhao Xinci figure out that Professor Shen (or his earlier editions as grad-student Shen Wei, etc.) is the Black-Cloaked Envoy? Was he in fact instrumental in setting up this cover identity?
6. What, if anything, does Zhao Xinci know about Zhang Shi’s plans for the Lantern wick? If he knows, what does he make of it? Is he present in the episode-40 flashback to Zhao Yunlan learning about the wick, and/or did he condone the conversation?
Fanworks
I haven’t managed to sort through everything in which Zhao Xinci appears, so please rec and/or self-rec your favorites! I chose a handful here, trying to sort for some different takes and perspectives:
Purple (Like the Shadows in Your Heart) by anecdotalist
If someone were to ask Zhao Xinci later, he wouldn’t have been able to say when it was that things changed between him and his wife.
Prince of Thorns by Sylvia
A rose thicket encages the SID, Zhao Yunlan is trapped in unnatural sleep, and Shen Wei is forced to rely on Zhao Xinci’s assistance.
make up for my regrets by china_shop
Zhang Shi takes stock of his new life.
Light for light by lately
How Zhao Xinci saved the day and his son. A canon fix-it.
filled my lungs with oxygen by egelantier
Zhao Yunlan and Shen Wei are enjoying their happily ever after together. But there's a price Shen Wei has to pay, over and over again, for both of them staying alive. Zhao Yunlan is prepared.
(N: Zhao Xinci just has a cameo in this one, but it’s a really good cameo.)
Also a shamefaced self-rec because I put a lot of my ideas about Zhao Xinci in here: Thinking Outside the Box
(Quick note just in case: Zhao Xinci and his relationship with Zhao Yunlan in particular can cut close to the bone for a lot of people, and he may be the most divisive character we’ve talked about yet, even including Ye Zun. Different opinions on him are FINE by me; let’s call this a place to share ideas rather than to try and convince one another of anything.)
Who he is
Zhao Xinci is the Director of the Xingdu Bureau, the first chief of the SID, Zhao Yunlan’s estranged father, Shen Xi’s widower, and a reluctant headspace-sharer with Zhang Shi. In his field agent days he shared his son’s propensities for denim jackets and comfort over formality; as a senior bureaucrat he dresses like a dandy to rival Shen Wei (can I have a small fic about the two of them running into each other while purchasing ascots, please?) and favors a purple coat Zhu Jiu would envy. He is either Minister Gao’s direct superior, or has the upper hand anyway due to a long history of working together, greater competence, and a stronger personality.
After becoming the first SID chief, Zhao Xinci became more and more absorbed in his work, inflicting lasting damage on his relationship with his wife Shen Xi and their son, to which the coup de grâce was the death of Shen Xi as a hostage in the hands of Dixingren criminals. This (according to Zhang Shi) turned Zhao Xinci’s general law-enforcement dislike of Dixingren into an active obsession with putting down Dixingren criminals.
After a complex and tortuous path through the second half of the series, he ends up as part of an excellent triumvirate with Guo Ying and Li Qian, supporting the SID in extremis and providing competence, compassion, and smarts in administration as of the epilogue.
What he’s like
Zhao Xinci is a fascinating character: complex and ambiguous, ruthless but not beyond empathy, capable but lacking some of his son’s crucial skills, on the wrong side often but not necessarily a bad guy, inflexible but not humorless. He thinks on the fly almost as well as his son, but is much less inclined to change his behavior accordingly. Competence and efficiency are his watchwords; in episode 16 he reels off Guo Changcheng’s personal information effortlessly from memory, and assigns each SID member an investigative task suited to their specialties (including willingness to make use of Da Qing as a Yashou). He is not unwilling to shoot to kill, but not without provocation; he considers the Guardian Writ to back up the death penalty. He tends to follow the letter of the law where Zhao Yunlan is more likely to be concerned with the moral right of the matter. Zhao Yunlan notes, distinguishing him from Zhang Shi, that he’s a pragmatist with no concern for larger moral issues.
(He also has an incongruous name: 心慈, heart’s mercy, almost feminine (help me out, proper Chinese speakers?) and certainly far gentler than you would expect from a man of his demeanor.)
Two for the price of one
Zhao Xinci has shared his head with the Dixingren Zhang Shi for the last twenty years or so. Although initially promising “I won’t control you or take you over,” Zhang Shi tends to speak up in his host’s person at essential moments to soften Zhao Xinci’s approach to the SID and Dixing, but his ultimate morality is, to put it kindly, questionable. Zhao Xinci does give his consent to having Zhang Shi live more or less rent-free in his head, but it’s a) after the fact and b) very much a case of “we can do this the easy way or we can do this the hard way, up to you” (Zhang Shi implies that Zhao Xinci could hurt himself by trying to expel ZS forcibly, and ZXC has just seen ZS’s last host kill himself after “intermittent psychosis.”). Zhao Xinci, a pragmatist if ever there was one, accepts that he’s screwed and makes the best of it by getting ZS to provide Dixingren support for his work. It’s implied that ZXC’s mental cohabitation with Zhang Shi was actively bad for his health, with Zhang Shi’s activities as a source of cardiac stress leading to his emergency surgery on Reunion Night.
Notable moments
In Zhao Xinci’s conversation about his involvement with the superpower serum with Shen Wei (a bravura exercise in expressing large emotions through subdued restraint on both parts) he refers ominously to “protecting…the one both of us care about,” implying that a) he loves his son, and b) he knows Shen Wei does too (based on Zhao Yunlan’s defiant “He’s good to me” when he’s blind?).
In episode 29, we see a younger Zhao Xinci giving little!Zhao Yunlan instructions on proper investigation: an interesting combination of dad’s mania for efficiency with something of his son’s empathy. However, modern-day Zhao Xinci on his son: “that brat,” Zhao Yunlan on his father: “that old jerk.” When Zhao Yunlan offers on the rooftop to give his life in his father’s place, Zhao Xinci responds with dizzying venom, rendering his son completely speechless for almost the only time in forty episodes, even though he may know it’s not exactly true. When he can catch his breath, Zhao Yunlan retorts “I’m not like you. Instead of having regrets for twenty years, I’ll follow my heart [the advice younger!Zhao Xinci gave him] in the first place. Let me tell you that a sacrifice for family is worth it!” (consciously quoting Shen Wei?)
In episode 38, ZXC and ZS get a heroic entrance in time to help Zhao Yunlan overcome Professor Ouyang. Zhao Yunlan and his father get one last hug before the former heads off to Dixing, and Zhang Shi helpfully twists the knife: “How did it feel to hug your son? You’ve waited twenty years.” Zhao Xinci basically tells him to fuck off and I’m sorry to say I can’t blame him.
After forming a battlefield alliance with Li Qian and the patient Guo Ying to support Zhao Yunlan and the SID, Zhao Xinci fights with the Yashou in the big messy struggle of episodes 39 and 40. Sending Lao Chu, Zhu Hong, and Da Qing off to Dixing, ZXC tells them that it’s an honor for his son to have them as colleagues, a major admission for the prejudiced Zhao Xinci to make to two Yashou and a Dixingren. He provides Da Qing with the serum which will be a key part of defeating Ye Zun.
In episode 40, we see ZXC thriving, still in purple, along with Minister Guo and Director Li. A flashback shows him explaining the Lantern sacrifice to Zhao Yunlan, with an excruciating instant of silence between father and son in which Zhao Yunlan understands and accepts that he may be the one to step into the Lantern, and Zhao Xinci turns away from him in pain. Zhao Yunlan asks him to promise that if it does happen, Zhang Shi will step in for him and live his life well, Zhao Xinci accepts, and they have a horribly awkward, tearful hug. It could be that this is all Zhang Shi here, given “how did it feel to hug your son?” later on, but I really hope not.
Discussion questions
1. What are the similarities and differences between Zhao Xinci and his son?
2. How did Zhao Xinci and Zhang Shi interact over the years? Did they learn from one another? Was Zhao Xinci resigned to having Zhang Shi in his head forever, or what? What did Zhang Shi think of Zhao Xinci? (If Zhao Yunlan had actually shot him with the dark-energy gun, would it have killed ZS without harming ZXC, or what?)
3. What is Zhao Xinci’s relationship with Da Qing in particular? We talk a lot about Zhao Yunlan having been raised by cats; Da Qing and Zhao Xinci “worked together for ten years”—from the time the SID was founded, when Zhao Yunlan was, what, eight or nine on? How did ZXC and DQ get along?
4. Do we ever find out what “Xingdu” is anyway, as in the Xingdu Bureau? It looks like the hanzi are 星督, basically “planetary supervisory/Haixing Supervisory,” which is helpfully vague.
5. When does Zhao Xinci figure out that Professor Shen (or his earlier editions as grad-student Shen Wei, etc.) is the Black-Cloaked Envoy? Was he in fact instrumental in setting up this cover identity?
6. What, if anything, does Zhao Xinci know about Zhang Shi’s plans for the Lantern wick? If he knows, what does he make of it? Is he present in the episode-40 flashback to Zhao Yunlan learning about the wick, and/or did he condone the conversation?
Fanworks
I haven’t managed to sort through everything in which Zhao Xinci appears, so please rec and/or self-rec your favorites! I chose a handful here, trying to sort for some different takes and perspectives:
Purple (Like the Shadows in Your Heart) by anecdotalist
If someone were to ask Zhao Xinci later, he wouldn’t have been able to say when it was that things changed between him and his wife.
Prince of Thorns by Sylvia
A rose thicket encages the SID, Zhao Yunlan is trapped in unnatural sleep, and Shen Wei is forced to rely on Zhao Xinci’s assistance.
make up for my regrets by china_shop
Zhang Shi takes stock of his new life.
Light for light by lately
How Zhao Xinci saved the day and his son. A canon fix-it.
filled my lungs with oxygen by egelantier
Zhao Yunlan and Shen Wei are enjoying their happily ever after together. But there's a price Shen Wei has to pay, over and over again, for both of them staying alive. Zhao Yunlan is prepared.
(N: Zhao Xinci just has a cameo in this one, but it’s a really good cameo.)
Also a shamefaced self-rec because I put a lot of my ideas about Zhao Xinci in here: Thinking Outside the Box
(Quick note just in case: Zhao Xinci and his relationship with Zhao Yunlan in particular can cut close to the bone for a lot of people, and he may be the most divisive character we’ve talked about yet, even including Ye Zun. Different opinions on him are FINE by me; let’s call this a place to share ideas rather than to try and convince one another of anything.)
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Zhao Xinci and Zhao Yunlan are diametrically opposed in some ways—their attitude (on the surface, anyway) toward Dixingren, Zhao Xinci’s tendency to extreme measures and Zhao Yunlan’s to innovative solutions and cooperation, Zhao Xinci’s fondness for bureaucracy, hierarchy, and following the rules and Zhao Yunlan’s, well, everything. But they also share similarities—they both like five-dimensional chess (see: Zhao Xinci keeping the SID loyal to Zhao Yunlan in episode 16, Zhao Yunlan pretending to be hypnotized, etc etc); Zhao Yunlan is as all-in committed to his job as his father was, though he does it differently, and there are moments when you can see something of Zhao Yunlan’s insouciance and subversion in Zhao Xinci. In episode 16, when he has just scolded the SID about what they would do if a new case came in with Zhao Yunlan away, the phone rings with, sure enough, a new case, and Zhao Xinci spreads his arms deadpan—see? I told you so—in a very Zhao Yunlan gesture (h/t china_shop who noticed this one). In the episode 31 flashback, Zhao Xinci’s reaction to Zhang Shi’s explanation of what he is is to shake his head, look sideways and chuckle, a typical Zhao Yunlanism. Zhao Xinci’s feint/faint in episode 38, allowing him to punch out Minister Gao, is also a very Zhao Yunlanesque tactic.
The father-son interaction in episodes 28-29 is just brutal, beginning with Zhao Yunlan’s shattered face when Guo Ying tells him his father is in the hands of Wang Xiangyang; it never even occurs to him to act as if he doesn’t care about his father personally (and this is Zhao Yunlan, who gets through life with a catlike surface layer of casual who-me?). Shen Wei: “Calm down. You know how different you are from your father. So why would he recommend you as Chief of the SID? Because he believes in you.” Instead of just cutting to his final point—“you’re the chief of the SID and the Lord Guardian of Haixing, if you break down the city will fall into chaos”—Shen Wei is essentially offering a new answer to their fraught conversation in the previous episode, on the topic of Zhao Xinci and trust. Don’t let worries about your relationship with your father make this harder for you; he would trust you to do this for him. (During Zhao Xinci’s vicious little setpiece on the rooftop, Shen Wei in the background has tears coming to his eyes.)
Diagonal to the main themes of the drama, the triangular interaction of Zhao Xinci, Zhao Yunlan, and Zhang Shi over twenty years verges on classical tragedy in the way they box one another in, with Zhao Yunlan taking the worst of it while he’s still his father’s son, and Zhao Xinci likely to suffer more in the years when he can’t ever grieve his son in public.
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Zhao Xinci likely to suffer more in the years when he can’t ever grieve his son in public
Oh wow I never thought about that before, but mmmmm that's rough stuff, there. I love it.
And from the larger post: a bravura exercise in expressing large emotions through subdued restraint on both parts
This is just a great, great phrase.
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mmmmm that's rough stuff, there.
yeah, this is something that really troubles me about the end, even if it was Zhao Yunlan's choice to have Zhang Shi take his place. Zhao Xinci looks pretty happy in the epilogue, but I think the (secret) loss of his son will inevitably come back one day and hit him hard.
and thanks again for kind words ♡. I'm always awed by the tea house scene; it's so polite and calm and quiet and yet there's SO MUCH going on under the surface for both of them.
no subject
as a senior bureaucrat he dresses like a dandy to rival Shen Wei (can I have a small fic about the two of them running into each other while purchasing ascots, please?)
Heh, and now I want that fic, too. Maybe they have the same tailor? :D
When does Zhao Xinci figure out that Professor Shen (or his earlier editions as grad-student Shen Wei, etc.) is the Black-Cloaked Envoy? Was he in fact instrumental in setting up this cover identity?
It’s not stated in the drama, but I always thought that Zhao Xinci knew from the beginning about Shen Wei. And that, yes, he was involved in some way in setting it up.
no subject
That scene on the rooftop, and Zhao Yunlan’s reaction, always hits me right in the heart. Zhao Yunlan might understand logically why his father is saying all those things, but it still hurts.
Absolutely. Zhao Yunlan is always three steps ahead of the conversation and always has a smart remark, so seeing him so knocked back is heartwrenching.
Maybe they have the same tailor? :D
Maybe they do! Inquiring minds want to know!
I always thought that Zhao Xinci knew from the beginning about Shen Wei. And that, yes, he was involved in some way in setting it up.
Me too, although I haven't really figured out the timeline.
no subject
Zhao Xinci is so ruthless in pushing the superpower serum research ahead, putting pressure on Prof. Ouyang to speed things up and skip proper procedure. Zhang Shi tries to mitigate that somewhat, but in that scene, Zhao Xinci comes across just as much as a fanatic as Prof. Ouyang sometimes does. Very unpleasant.
But he doesn't seem to be bothered by Yashou much. He mostly seems to disregard them, which is fair enough when they mostly keep out of things. As for Da Qing in particular - the SID was founded 20 years ago according to the Zhang Shi flashback, and Da Qing has been with the SID for 10. So Da Qing arrived at the SID when Zhao Xinci was already well established. I always wondered what Zhao Xinci's SID looked like, but he's the one who recruited Da Qing after all. I would have loved to see how that went! But I like the idea that Da Qing found Zhao Yunlan first (who would have been a teenager at the time), got close to him, and ended up on Zhao Xinci's radar that way, who promptly recruited him for the SID. Maybe only partly because he thought he could use him, and just as much because he wanted some control over the Yashou who was cosying up to his son?
Is he present in the episode-40 flashback to Zhao Yunlan learning about the wick, and/or did he condone the conversation?
I always assumed that was all Zhang Shi, but what Zhao Xinci thought about it, I still have no idea. Of course, I'm not 100% sure what Zhang Shi was thinking either!
When does Zhao Xinci figure out that Professor Shen (or his earlier editions as grad-student Shen Wei, etc.) is the Black-Cloaked Envoy? Was he in fact instrumental in setting up this cover identity?
My theory has always been that he didn't know until Shen Wei re-contacted him after meeting Zhao Yunlan. But it's also entirely possible he didn't know until that tea house scene in episode 27 -
no subject
he doesn't seem to be bothered by Yashou much... But I like the idea that Da Qing found Zhao Yunlan first (who would have been a teenager at the time), got close to him, and ended up on Zhao Xinci's radar that way, who promptly recruited him for the SID.
I think he includes Yashou with Dixingren when he's arguing with Zhao Yunlan in ZYL's apartment, saying "They'll all go back where they came from eventually," but he certainly doesn't seem to hate them specifically. And I love the idea of Da Qing and Zhao Yunlan getting close first. Da Qing clearly looked at him and said "okay, this kid is definitely Cat Tribe manqué, time to adopt him..."
That is an excellent fic, thanks for bringing it up! I love all the tension implicit just below the surface in the tea house scene. I'm inclined to agree with you about the timing--I had completely missed the water-murder timing thing, nice catch--while still thinking that setting up Shen Wei's cover identity might have been done in tandem with founding the SID, with Zhao Xinci in on it if not senior enough to be actually in charge. Gah, Shen Wei, don't be so damn secretive all the time (talk about a lost cause)...
no subject
And also, there's Zhang Shi - I do wonder if, if he wasn't involved or told officially, Zhao Xinci might have met Shen Wei and found out the truth via Zhang Shi, who might have recognised the Envoy?
Anyway, my personal headcanon is that he knew the truth by the time he tries to warn Zhao Yunlan away from him, and Zhao Yunlan tells him Shen Wei is genuinely good to him. Even though that scene still totally works if he didn't!
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Also, I love your prompt and I desperately want to give it a shot. Just as soon as I look up what an ascot is. XD
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I look forward to your ascot research results! Also, lovely icon. Li Qian at her best.
no subject
*sets up a refreshment stand with bottled water and energy bars*
Also, I find Zhao Xinci a little hard to get my head around, because sometimes I can’t tell if it’s him or Zhang Shi speaking. But here goes! (I’m coming from a drama-only perspective.)
Politically, the main difference is that Zhao Yunlan is committed to peace between all the people (humans, Yashou and Dixingren), and Zhao Xinci is concerned with protecting humans above all else, primarily from Dixingren. I suspect this bigotry partly stems from his coming from a policing background and tending to see all Dixingren as a threat. /o\ He doesn’t hate Yashou because he doesn’t see them as a threat.
As far as leadership style goes, Zhao Xinci is more inclined to confront, shame and rebuke, and Zhao Yunlan tends towards manipulating, cancelling bonuses and using people’s loyalty to him (and also listening and understanding). Zhao Yunlan is much more team-as-family than I can imagine Zhao Xinci ever was, and Zhao Xinci is much more inclined to delegate and lead from above, rather than from in front. (Plus he casually and without provocation pulls a gun on Guo Changcheng, which is pretty dramatic even if that particular gun can’t do serious harm.)
Personally, it’s hard to say what traits they share. They both have close relationships with Dixingren? *g* Zhao Xinci socialises with Minister Guo, whom he outranks, and Zhao Yunlan is best friends with his own deputy… They’re both stubborn as hell. And as you say, they both take the job very seriously.
Given that Zhao Yunlan can tell when Zhao Xinci is “not himself”, Zhang Shi must have been fairly quiet while Zhao Yunlan was growing up. (Btw, do we know if Zhang Shi’s appearance pre- or post-dates Shen Xi’s death? There’s a flashback with Zhao Yunlan talking about how he’s going to save the world with his kind heart and brilliance, and in that, Zhao Xinci is in hospital and Zhao Yunlan is still speaking to him – perhaps he was hospitalised for reasons relating to adjusting to Zhang Shi’s presence?) (And speaking of which, Zhao Xinci clearly had no compunction about telling his son that Dixing and its people exist, when most of Haixing is comfortably oblivious.)
Anyway, Zhao Xinci and Zhang Shi have an unimaginably intimate relationship that’s been going on for twenty years, during which Zhao Xinci’s been widowed (or was already a widower) and estranged from his son. Zhang Shi is generally warmer and more compassionate, and I imagine that’s been a comfort to Zhao Xinci, especially in the middle of the night. (No matter how pragmatic someone is, surely they occasionally wake up filled with regrets and horrible memories?) They disagree about politics and parenting, but they still work well together. I ship them, despite all the messed-up complexities of control and power struggles and bigotry/hypocrisy between them! (The main source of hypocrisy being Zhao Xinci’s war against Dixingren while secretly housing one and giving him covert influence over a series of official Haixing positions.)
I doubt they had much of a personal relationship. Zhao Xinci no doubt found his skills useful. And yes, maybe his influence over Zhao Yunlan. I love
(Aside: I do think Da Qing must have joined the SID after Shen Wei stopped working with them, or wouldn’t Shen Wei have kept closer tabs on what was happening there, for Da Qing’s own sake as well as the possible lead to finding Kunlun?)
At Shen Wei’s first meeting with Minister Gao, Minister Gao says, “Xingdu Bureau is the highest authority in Dragon city. It also has final authority over the SID, though normally it won't give you orders directly.” FWIW. :-)
I’d guess that the Department of Supervision has control over operational matters (police, SID, research lab, etc), and the Xingdu Bureau is more policy, diplomacy, oversight, etc? *is very hazy about this*
When I came up with Tea with the Envoy, I was working on the basis that there was nothing in canon to contradict that reading, but the more I think about it, the better it works for me that Zhao Xinci doesn’t find out until sometime during the present-day canon timeline. If Zhao Xinci knew all along, surely he would have ensured subsequent SID chiefs were also informed? It’s important information for the job, especially if you view the Envoy/Dixingren with suspicion!
Otoh, I can imagine Shen Wei arriving in Haixing expecting to form a new alliance like the one 10k years ago, and Zhao Xinci looking at him like, “You’re a kid. You’re literally a university student. I can’t take you seriously.” And a lot of their problems stemming from that. But that wouldn’t explain why he wouldn’t tell Zhao Yunlan, especially once he finds out they know each other.
And it makes sense to me that Minister Gao would mention Shen Wei’s actions at the wedding, and Zhao Xinci would conclude he’s Dixingren and consider that a sufficient reason to warn Zhao Yunlan away.
Ooh, this is such a good question! Argh. Now I’m really upset by my default reading that that whole conversation was just between Zhao Yunlan and Zhang Shi, and Zhao Xinci never got to say goodbye. I need to rewatch that scene and think about this some more! (Note to self.)
Other thoughts. I’m going to bullet point them, because *flails* too many words…
WXY: The Ex-Chief Zhao of SID, you know him, right?
BSX: Yes, I know him
WXY: He is the most literate and knowledgeable person I know. When our child arrives in this world, I’ll go ask him for a good name!
Secondly,
♥ ♥ ♥ I love this description!!
Thirdly,
I don’t think he’s quoting Shen Wei. I think this is his life’s motto, internalised after his mother’s death, the bedrock belief he and Shen Wei share, intrinsic to both of them. YMMV, of course. :-)
Fourthly, I wonder about Zhao Xinci’s take on Wang Xiangyang, given Zhao Xinci is also a widower, and the two of them have a long association. I wonder how much the quote in your subject line is intended to be scathing, and how much it’s actually fellow feeling.
I wonder if part of that was trying to hide Zhang Shi from his family (or shield his family from Zhang Shi)? Idk. I’m not sure of the timeline there. And there’s no doubt Zhao Xinci was a workaholic on top of that, so -- could be both?
I wonder if that’s partly a political manoeuvre—find common ground and force Shen Wei’s hand? Coerce Shen Wei into putting Haixing’s interests first?
Ooh, excellent point! I guess it really is Zhao Xinci’s dress sense, and not Zhang Shi’s! (Zhang Shi never gets to choose his own clothes. Heh.)
ZXC: I thought you had changed. I didn't realize you're still a fool who only seems flexible on the outside. If you don't shift the blame to someone else, then you need to take it on. But don't you forget, Haixing Inspectorate set up the SID. They can also shut it down.
ZYL: As you wish, sir. (stalks out, slamming the door after him)
ZXC: Stupid boy. For you, I will take on this burden.[1]
[1] Wait, is that ZXC or Zhang Shi? Argh!
*downloads all the fic for later* (And eee, thanks for the rec! ♥) I’ve made a few other fanworks featuring Zhao Xinci:
- A little light deception
- astringent, spicy, sour, sweet (only in one scene)
- Tea with the Envoy
- Zhao Xinci & Zhang Shi icons
Also, here’s
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They’re both stubborn as hell.
LOL you are so right. How could I not have included this point <3
(Btw, do we know if Zhang Shi’s appearance pre- or post-dates Shen Xi’s death? There’s a flashback with Zhao Yunlan talking about how he’s going to save the world with his kind heart and brilliance
・Zhang Shi appears while Shen Xi is still alive: when little!Zhao Yunlan calls his dad during the ZXC/ZS introductory conversation in the mirror, ZXC says “I’ll be home later, you and your mom eat dinner first.”
・In the flashback, little!Zhao Yunlan says something like “I’ll save the world with my kindness, my wits, and my life,” which, OUCH, foreshadowing much ;(
All of your reasoning on why ZXC didn’t know until now that Shen Wei was the Envoy makes sense; for some reason I’m just really stuck on the idea that he knew from early on, I don’t know why.
Now I’m really upset by my default reading that that whole conversation was just between Zhao Yunlan and Zhang Shi, and Zhao Xinci never got to say goodbye.
I am also upset by this, because I think it’s canonically accurate. In actual drama time the flashback conversation, including a hug, happens first; then Zhao Yunlan sets off for Dixing via the cave, with a hug for his father on his way out. After he’s gone, Zhang Shi says to Zhao Xinci “How did it feel hugging your son for the first time in twenty years?” implying that Zhao Xinci wasn’t “present” for the flashback hug. I find this upsetting and pretty damn cruel on Zhang Shi’s part, no matter how important the matter at hand was…
WXY: He is the most literate and knowledgeable person I know.
I completely missed this because I find all Wang Xiangyang’s scenes so unwatchable! Nice catch. So Zhao Yunlan comes by his habit of literary expressions honestly.
Zhao Xinci telegraphs with his eyes/expression, “Give up on me. I want you to live,” and “If these are the last words you hear me speak, know they’re not true.” But Zhao Yunlan who is usually so perceptive and sharp can’t see clearly, because his own resentment, righteousness and feelings of inadequacy get in the way.
aaagh, where did I read this--someone, who was it, was just writing somewhere in fic or meta that—as you say, basically—Zhao Yunlan has always been afraid at some level that what his father is saying is true, and so when he hears it in so many words it’s hard not to believe it, even though he knows it’s a gambit on ZXC’s part. (Also, I wonder if part of the reason Shen Wei looks so upset in the background, apart from pain on ZYL’s behalf, is remembering his own confrontation 10,000 years ago with Ye Zun?) It’s a shattering scene.
I wonder how much the quote in your subject line is intended to be scathing, and how much it’s actually fellow feeling.
Yes—I think it’s both, it is definitely scathing, but he wouldn’t say it at all if there wasn’t some warmth in it. And I never thought of them as both widowers—nice catch again.
I wonder if part of that was trying to hide Zhang Shi from his family (or shield his family from Zhang Shi)? Idk. I’m not sure of the timeline there. And there’s no doubt Zhao Xinci was a workaholic on top of that, so -- could be both?
I would say “all of the above”—another way in which I feel ZXC, ZS, and ZYL were so caught up in a framework that made each of them end up hurting the others so much.
I wonder if that’s partly a political manoeuvre—find common ground and force Shen Wei’s hand?
Absolutely. I don’t think ZXC does anything that isn’t at least partly a political maneuver (argh, your NZ and my US spellings are confusing me and now none of the options looks right)
When Zhao Yunlan says of Shen Wei, “He’s good to me,” I wonder if that’s supposed to be a contrast to (his view of) Zhao Xinci and Shen Xi, or even Zhao Xinci and Zhao Yunlan? It feels loaded to me.
It’s possible! My feeling is that he’s coming as close as possible within exterior constraints to saying “He loves me.”
I do find it hard to forgive him for badmouthing Zhao Yunlan to the rest of the SID when we first meet him (with comments like, “I know my own son. Only he would say such random and impudent things.”)! Just – why would you undermine him like that?!! And put the idea in his subordinates’ minds that he doesn’t deserve to lead?!! WTF, Zhao Xinci?!?
In practice, I think the SID team has such bedrock loyalty to Zhao Yunlan that the only one being undermined is Zhao Xinci himself (and that he’s basically working to confirm that this is the case), but you’re right, it’s unprofessional.
ZXC: I thought you had changed. I didn't realize you're still a fool who only seems flexible on the outside.
YOU’RE ONE TO TALK, ZHAO XINCI
If you don't shift the blame to someone else, then you need to take it on. But don't you forget, Haixing Inspectorate set up the SID. They can also shut it down.
ZYL: As you wish, sir. (stalks out, slamming the door after him)
ZXC: Stupid boy. For you, I will take on this burden.[
This whole conversation in which ZXC, ZS, and ZYL fail spectacularly to communicate with one another, oh dear. My reading is that Zhao Xinci, while also just plain losing his temper, is trying to remind Zhao Yunlan to be more politically savvy—ZYL has just said “I’m going to protect my people,” and ZXC’s point is that keeping the SID from being shut down will be instrumental therein, and in his final line, that if ZYL can’t do it for himself ZXC will do his best.
Oh dear, I could go on rambling about all this for ever…
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Phew! I was afraid I might have been too wall-of-text-y. *g*
Ah, thank you! (I screencapped that scene for my icons; I really should've remembered.) So yeah, for some unspecified length of time, Shen Xi was married to ZXC while Zhang Shi was ~present~ (for some value of present). I wonder if she knew... *squinches eyes at potential dubcon aspects*
Maybe because they never show us finding out? It's like, that could have been a significant plot beat, and the fact that it was omitted implies it wasn't needed because he already knew. (I had been assuming too, until I wrote that fic.)
Oh, but at least ZXC did get a goodbye hug. And the fact that ZYL gave it suggests he knew the other one was with Zhang Shi, right? *has not watched those scenes in a while* So that actually makes me feel better. Thanks!
I mean, the whole "Wick Substitution 101" contingency plan sucks, obviously, but I can see why ZYL might not have been capable of having that conversation with his dad at that time, under such pressure. I just really wanted them to get a reconciliation beat, and they did.
Yes, I think that's exactly why it's so powerful. And to some degree, you know, there probably are a few tiny grains of truth buried in there -- that's why those are the things that come out of ZXC's when he reaches for verbal weapons. Maybe they're waiting to be said, and that's one of the reasons they hit home so hard. But they're not The Truth, and ZYL totally can't hear that.
So do you think there was any good that came out of their connections? Like, I feel like Zhang Shi might have prompted ZXC occasionally to at least try to step outside his rigidity and be supportive or kind to young!ZYL, and Zhang Shi loves ZYL (we know that from the library scene in ep 16, when he's talking to Sang Zan), and ZXC isn't left entirely alone after Shen Xi dies... There has to be some good there, right? For all of them? The real pain comes from the secrets.
And, whoa, okay, now I'm thinking that to an outsider (to ZYL in some lights, perhaps?) Zhang Shi and ZXC are an analogue of the Envoy and Shen Wei -- the hidden Dixing alter ego (that had to be forced to reveal itself) -- though obviously it's not at all the same for Shen Wei (he is both identities, and the hiddeness is very different, too). Only the Zhang Shi revelation is so much worse because it was right there in ZYL's own family, right under his nose, while he was being brought up to think that Dixingren were all criminals and needed to be hunted down, even if he didn't completely buy that line. (I don't know if that makes any sense. I only just thought of it, and it's laaate. But I'll leave it here anyway.)
Ooh, yes, that too. But in some ways, "He's good to me" is actually more important for a parent to hear, more salient, than "He loves me", I think? Like, lots of people treat people they love really badly, you know? Being treated well is just as rare and precious. And maybe more valued, in a society which has an emphasis on marriage as a duty (which, I don't know how much Haixing has that, but maybe a bit?).
Or maybe it's just that ZYL still hasn't fully grasped that he's lovable at that point, and he doesn't think of framing it that way. Or saying the L-word to his dad, in any context, is unthinkable. *rueful*
Haha, very true. Maybe he's playing some kind of enemy-of-my-enemy gambit to get the team to unify even more? Who knows?! (Though it is pretty early days at that point. Guo Changcheng doubts Chu Shuzhi's loyalty to their chief, and not entirely without reason, given how anti-Dixing ZYL reportedly was earlier in his career.)
Yeah, though he's also advocating shifting the blame to someone else. (Lao-Chu?) /o\ /o\ /o\
It's glorious! *hearts you* But I have to go to sleep now. *waves goodnight*
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Yes, this is a great point! My impression is that Zhang Shi only started to appear more and override Zhao Xinci on occasion only when the present-day crisis really gears up, and that before that he mainly kept to the background, speaking only to Zhao Xinci.
And speaking of which, Zhao Xinci clearly had no compunction about telling his son that Dixing and its people exist, when most of Haixing is comfortably oblivious.
True! And his wife, too, I'd assume, since we see both Shen Xi and Zhao Yunlan at the SID - I don't think he'd have let them in there if the whole existence of everything they work on is supposed to be secret from them.
Zhang Shi is generally warmer and more compassionate, and I imagine that’s been a comfort to Zhao Xinci, especially in the middle of the night. (No matter how pragmatic someone is, surely they occasionally wake up filled with regrets and horrible memories?) They disagree about politics and parenting, but they still work well together. I ship them, despite all the messed-up complexities of control and power struggles and bigotry/hypocrisy between them!
I like this description a lot. :)
If Zhao Xinci knew all along, surely he would have ensured subsequent SID chiefs were also informed? It’s important information for the job, especially if you view the Envoy/Dixingren with suspicion!
Completely agreed on that.
Shen Wei arriving in Haixing expecting to form a new alliance like the one 10k years ago, and Zhao Xinci looking at him like, “You’re a kid. You’re literally a university student. I can’t take you seriously.”
That doesn't really fit with the impression I got from the show, which is that the whole SID takes the Envoy super-seriously. Surely if that were Zhao Xinci's attitude, it would have filtered down.
(Also, thinking about the timeline - whatever Haixing identity Shen Wei got when he first came to present-day Haixing can't have been his current identity (the one that became Professor Shen). Because "Professor Shen" is 32 years old, so 20 years ago he would have been 12, and he can't exactly pass as a 12-year-old. *g* So "you're literally a student" probably didn't apply.)
Zhao Xinci is being scornful to convince the bad guys that using Zhao Yunlan to retaliate against Zhao Xinci won’t work. That it’s a bad trade. (He knows Zhao Yunlan so well, he must know there’s no way to make him back down!)
I agree with you on what Zhao Xinci is trying to do, but I'm not sure how well he really does know his son. He may think Zhao Yunlan would actually back down! Because remember when the SID has been exposed and is in danger? and Zhao Xinci tells him to shift the blame to someone else (i.e. Chu Shuzhi)? He seems to actually think he can talk Zhao Yunlan into going along with that.
I don’t think he’s quoting Shen Wei. I think this is his life’s motto, internalised after his mother’s death, the bedrock belief he and Shen Wei share, intrinsic to both of them. YMMV, of course. :-)
Yes! Agreed!
Here’s my question: in Haixing terms, is Zhao Xinci a good father? He’s concerned for his son, tries to steer him down a good path, helps him in his career. He’s prepared to sacrifice for him. He doesn’t have much patience with Zhao Yunlan’s attitude and what-he-sees-as weakness or rebellion – but that might be seen as a good thing in Haixing?
All of that might be part of being a good father, but I think the worst thing for a parent is to refuse to see who their child is as a person, and that seems to be exactly what Zhao Xinci is doing in the scene I mentioned above. Obviously using Chu Shuzhi (or anyone) as a scapegoat is an awful thing for an official to do, but on a personal level, to me, thinking Zhao Yunlan would ever accept that is also the worst indictment of Zhao Xinci as a father. He seems to love Zhao Yunlan, but also seems to be thinking "well, Yunlan is wrong, but surely he will eventually see the light!" He doesn't bother to try to understand his son even to the not-very-deep point of realising Zhao Yunlan would never, ever betray or egive up on one of his team. He just ... doesn't seem to want to see his son clearly.
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I have to either accept that Zhao Yunlan isn't really grown-up enough yet to get over his childhood traumas as he ought to, or that Zhao Xinci was a pretty bad example of a father. Zhao Yunlan's statement "haven't seen him in 15 years" (I can't find the quote, I hope I'm not misremembering it) means that he left Zhao Xinci's household when he was no older than 16, a minor, and that Zhao Xinci did not get him back. Whether Zhao Yunlan ran away, lived with a relative (who?), or went to boarding school, this looks like a pretty telling indictment of Zhao Xinci. Zhao Yunlan is obviously still carrying wounds from his childhood, and there's really nobody else around to blame for them but Zhao Xinci.
This doesn't make Zhao Xinci less interesting or well-developed as a character! I see him as man devoted to duty, who is not suited for any kind of emotional engagement. He says as much in the flashback to Shen Xi that little Yunlan witnesses. He has no idea of how to be a father, and probably not much interest in learning to be a good one. He loves Zhao Yunlan in the most detached way, as his duty as a father, but without affection. (I would be interested to hear of any evidence to the contrary!) I'm pretty sure that any affection or caring we see coming from Zhao Xinci is actually Zhang Shi.
I had a recent thought that the Regent and Zhao Xinci perform analogous roles in their respective spheres of control. They are the representatives of administrative control in Dixing and Haixing, primarily concerned with the stability and continuity of the system. They are the upper-level bureaucrats who survive calamity, living to see, and perhaps to control, the new order.
More trivially, has anyone else recognized that Zhang Shi is a Tokra?
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This is just my off-the-cuff take. Not trying to convince you. It's a good question, and it made me have thoughts. :-)
IMO, 90 to 95 percent of ZYL's distaste for his father is personal. ZXC deliberately caused ZYL's mother death, right in front of his eyes, and in that moment ZXC declared she would be okay with his choice. He said, in subtext, not only is the rest of the world more important than my son, but his mother thinks so too.
Since then, I think ZYL has internalised that worthlessness but not forgiven his father for his words and actions (and as far as we know, ZXC has never asked for forgiveness). I don't think that makes ZYL immature. After all, it wasn't just a trauma; it was a betrayal, too. It does make him stubborn and principled in a way, and deeply deeply hurt (a hurt which has scarred over and given him the blackened heart Da Qing refers to in ep 8). Add in incompatible personalities, young!ZYL not having any other visible parent figure to fall back on to help him heal, and the other five to ten percent of political disagreement, and that's enough (for me) to justify ZYL's reactions in the show. Obviously YMMV. :-)
I see affection there, but also someone incredibly unbelievably crap at expressing it and unable to rein in his critical side. /my 2 cents
ETA: I'm not trying to argue that ZXC isn't a terrible father. Just that I personally don't think he's a villain on a par with the Regent.
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Zhao Yunlan's statement "haven't seen him in 15 years"
Do you have any memory in what context that happened? Because I don't remember that, but I'd love to find the source.
They are the representatives of administrative control in Dixing and Haixing, primarily concerned with the stability and continuity of the system.
Oooh, that's an interesting parallel! I don't think Zhao Xinci is nearly as terrible as the Regent, and I do think he loves his son in his own inadequate way, but he is extremely "us-against-them", a bigot who will encourage unethical research and scapegoat innocents without any noticeable qualms.
More trivially, has anyone else recognized that Zhang Shi is a Tokra?
Hee! :D
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Yes, I can see this (to some extent). Your take on Zhao Xinci is a lot more severe than mine (I'm almost certainly too easy on him...), but I agree that whether or not he has the emotional investment in his son, he does a bad job of acting on it most of the time.
I'm pretty sure that any affection or caring we see coming from Zhao Xinci is actually Zhang Shi.
I'd push back to the extent that I think Zhao Xinci does have the affection and caring in him somewhere, but it seems canonical that a lot of the expressed affection we see post-Zhang Shi's advent is coming from ZS, yup.
why is Zhao Yunlan so adamantly estranged from his father?
This is a hard one, because it's very true, and at the same time Zhao Yunlan obviously cares about his father at some level--the whole rooftop scene and its leadup, etc. etc. He hasn't gotten to the point of just writing off his father as someone who doesn't matter in his life. So Zhao Yunlan does see something in his father to care about (which could be all Zhang Shi! It's hard to say!) or is just a good enough person to care anyway (which he is, I think, either way)... I don't have any solid answers to this one, it's so much a matter of perspective for me.
In regard to all of the above, I wonder if you could say that learning to express affection, and to recognize affection expressed, is one of the themes of the drama... Xiao Guo and Lao Chu, Zhu Hong's dream, Lin Jing's password for Sha Ya's planetarium ring, all the estranged siblings, Zhang Ruonan/Wang Yike... I'm reaching a bit but it's fun to think about.
the Regent and Zhao Xinci perform analogous roles in their respective spheres of control
EXCELLENT insight. I find them very different as people, but your comparison of their roles is right on, and you could say that they have complementary flaws, Zhao Xinci's rigidity and the Regent's tendency to go with the last speaker (and then some). It's a pity we never see them talk to each other.
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Zhao Yunlan (to Zhao Xinci): "What you just said to me is more than you said to me in the last fifteen years." This is in the scene at the apartment complex's gate.
IIRC I don't think we know that they haven't seen each other in that long, they just haven't spoken much. Nor do I think it's stated in canon that Zhao Yunlan left home at a young age (though it's somewhat believable, especially if he went to boarding school).
Other clues to not seeing each other much: Zhao Yunlan didn't know about Zhao Xinci's promotion until Minister Gao told him about it; Zhao Yunlan didn't know Zhao Xinci recommended his son to become the head of the SID; they haven't hugged in 20 years [unclear/ambiguous if Zhang Shi hugged Zhao Yunlan in those 20 years, but given the awkwardness of the hug, I could believe he didn't]. Plus, we know how Zhao Xinci poured his focus into the SID and catching Dixing people, so even if their relationship was better than suggested, it seems likely there would be long stretches when they wouldn't have seen each other.
I don't quite see Zhao Xinci as a villain -- although he comes close, for me, when he tells Zhao Yunlan to basically get rid of the SID team, and when he's pushing for the serum to get made (I understand why he wants the serum, but at best he's unaware of Professor Ouyang's obsessive ruthlessness, and at worst he condones it). But I don't have any warm, fuzzy feelings for him, and my heart breaks for Zhao Yunlan, who carries a lot of emotional baggage from how his father treated him.
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What do you think would be the happiest possible post-canon fixit scenario for him? If we assume everyone lives, is there a reconciliation with Zhao Yunlan that would be possible and that could lead them to a better relationship? Any ideas how that could work?
Is there an AU that you think could have given him a happier life? If his wife didn't die? If his relationship with Zhang Shi played out differently from the beginning, like if they fell in love with each other and Zhao Xinci willingly chose to share a body with him?
Don't worry about spoiling me, I've read every spoiler I can find.
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Yes! We know he's friends with Minister Gao. I wonder if he has many other friends, and if they all go drinking -- or if his career/political ambitions and his secrets meant other friendships fell by the wayside.
I don't have answers for your questions right now (beyond reccing
ETA: I haven't actually read this because it's a fusion with the novel and I'm allergic to novel stuff (/dork), but
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For a post-canon fix-it, I did my best to work out my ideas in the fic kindly recced above; I feel as if he and Zhao Yunlan are never going to be on easy, intimate terms, partly because there's so much old pain involved and partly because they're just such different people, but I do think that (given the survival of everyone involved) they could end up respecting each other and being aware that, even if it's rarely expressed, they do love each other and share old, good memories with Shen Xi as well (as ZXC's phone lockscreen hints at).
An AU, oh goodness. Somewhere in this thread china_shop suggests that the secrets among ZXC, ZS and ZYL are what made their relationship so painful and messed up; if Zhao Xinci had been able to work more openly and more on his own terms with Zhang Shi, if his wife hadn't died (or if she'd died in a way that drew father and son together instead of pushing them apart), if Zhao Xinci had had someone who affected his view on Dixingren the way Zhao Yunlan has people (not just Shen Wei, but also a good working relationship with Chu Shuzhi, etc.)... . I can think of a bunch of possible interesting AU ideas.
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ZXC: *holding his gun on them* Drop the knife!
Unnamed Dixing guy: You drop the gun! Bring it over here! Now!
ZXC: Okay, okay! *spreads his hands* Don’t hurt innocent people!
UDG: Throw it over here! Quickly!
ZXC: *does*
Gu Ban: *shows up, watching from behind a tree*
UDG: Turn around, go behind the tree! Faster!
ZXC: *backing away* Stay calm!
And then Gu Ban saves Hua Yuzhu, and the unnamed guy shoots Gu Ban in the head with ZXC's gun, then drops the gun and runs away.
(I took screenshots of the unnamed guy and the Dixingren who held Shen Xi hostage, btw; they're both wearing black hoodies, but they're not the same person.)
Anyway, it seems pretty clear from ZXC's behaviour during the incident above and subsequently, that seeing this guy shoot Gu Ban at point black range with ZXC's gun hardened his attitudes (possibly traumatised him) and started him down the path to the point where he was prepared to point a gun at the guy who was holding his wife hostage -- and later, prepared to push for a serum that could irrevocably alter humankind. Possibly it was this incident that made him prepared to accept Zhang Shi, too, in exchange for a better chance at stopping dangerous Dixingren?
Has anyone made a ZXC timeline? I'm really tempted to, now.
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Question: I am now totally confused about the timeline. Is it canonically confirmed (she says lazily, without doing her own canon research) that Gu Ban's death takes place before Shen Xi's? My impression, given ZXC's graying hair and that Hua Yuzhu looks about the same age as when we see her in the present (of course, she's Dixingren so who knows), was that it took place sometime while ZXC was still SID Chief but not that long ago otherwise, well after Shen Xi's death.
it seems pretty clear from ZXC's behaviour ... that seeing this guy shoot Gu Ban at point blank range with ZXC's gun hardened his attitudes (possibly traumatised him) and started him down the path to the point where he was prepared to point a gun at the guy who was holding his wife hostage -- and later, prepared to push for a serum that could irrevocably alter humankind. Possibly it was this incident that made him prepared to accept Zhang Shi, too, in exchange for a better chance at stopping dangerous Dixingren?
Before or after Shen Xi's death, I buy your points in general--it's an example as far as ZXC is concerned of just how little good trying to deescalate a situation will do him, and how dangerous his putative enemies are prepared to be.
Mostly unrelated point, serious: While ZXC's motives in pushing the serum research forward were mostly terrible, if the serum hadn't reached the point it did by the end, it wouldn't have existed for Zhao Yunlan to use it on himself to help defeat Ye Zun either...
Mostly unrelated point, silly: Do you think there's a disreputable little shop somewhere selling nothing but black hoodies to Dixingren up to no good? Apart from those like Zhu Jiu whose fashion sense would never permit such a thing.
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