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sid_guardian2023-02-19 11:38 am
china_shop) wrote in sid_guardian2023-02-19 11:38 am
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GUARDIAN REWATCH – Episode 6
Beginning of episode: Zhao Yunlan interviews Mirror Girl's fiancé (Chu Shuzhi, Da Qing and Guo Changcheng are also present).
Ending of episode: Shen Wei is "mugged", AKA accosted by two lowlifes, and maintains his dignity to an infuriating-to-them degree.
Important scenes/developments:
- Da Qing and Guo Changcheng are tactless while interviewing Mirror Girl's fiancé, Ji Xiaobai, and Zhao Yunlan stomps on Da Qing's foot. (♥!)
- Guo Changcheng gives more of his tragic backstory and reminds Chu Shuzhi of his twin brother (who we see in a flashback).
- Shen Wei talks to Flower Yashou Ying Chun for the first time and voluntarily reveals (ie, connects) both of his identities to her in exchange for info.
- Zhao Yunlan goes to Shen Wei for
a cosy night-time chatadvice about the case, and Shen Wei points out this is their first not-a-suspect consultation. They both enjoy it. - Changcheng successfully thwarts someone stalking him... who turns out to be Ji Xiaobai, who's actually looking for him.
- The Envoy and the SID agree on a new policy, ie, that only Dixingren who've misused their powers will be deported.
- Zhao Yunlan confirms that Ji Xiaobai's real fiancée was the Dixingren who was taken away by the Envoy.
- The Envoy rebukes Mirror Girl, and she gives him a clue re the Mountain-River Awl.
- Zhao Yunlan and Da Qing sprawl around delightfully and gossip about Shen Wei. Da Qing says Zhao Yunlan has changed.
- Lin Jing figures out the location of Shen Wei's flat, and Zhao Yunlan and Da Qing search it. Da Qing mentions his ex-owner, Zhao Yunlan finds a file about the SID, and they both nearly get caught by Shen Wei.
- Zhao Yunlan and Da Qing send a message to Dixing enquiring about Shen Wei by name.
- Chu Shuzhi brings Shen Wei an ugly banner from Zhao Yunlan, and Zhao Yunlan and Da Qing watch via a camera hidden on the banner.
- Shen Wei confronts the Chancellor about Li Qian dropping out of university, and Zhao Yunlan overhears and talks to Shen Wei about it.
- The start of the mugging, and our
firstsecond glimpse of Shen Wei's pendant!
Thoughts
I've said a lot about this episode in other posts and fic (which I'll link in the comments below; please link to yours too!), but here are some things I particularly noticed this time.
- When Guo Changcheng gives his tragic backstory, Chu Shuzhi catches a tiny feel at learning he's an orphan, and a bigger one at "When everyone is happy, I am happy as well," which reminds him of his brother.
(I still love that Chu Shuzhi is walking around with two cans of beer in his pocket and is completely unapologetic about not having enough for Changcheng.) - I will never not love Shen Wei portalling back to his office to meet Zhao Yunlan, and Zhao Yunlan being just about to give up and leave.
This whole conversation is so enjoyable -- a little verbal sparring, some Dixing-related theorising, and a lot of flirting. Open enjoyment of each other's company. Zhao Yunlan being at least as intrigued by the phenomenon of Shen Wei speaking authoritatively about Dixing things as he is about the case. - When the wrong Weiwei comes back, Changcheng physically pushes Chu Shuzhi out of the room to give Weiwei and Ji Xiaobai some privacy. LOL. (Original Weiwei is mean. And look, the wedding ring is another significant jewelry item!)
- At 16:07, while investigating the mirror, Zhao Yunlan says, "It seems he was right again." 看来又被他说中了 I love when he references Shen Wei without saying his name -- it's a great way of showing how much Shen Wei is on his mind. (Also, there's a great Scooby Gang vibe to this scene, and I love how unhesitatingly Zhao Yunlan goes through the looking-glass. ♥!)
In the mirror dimension, Chu Shuzhi's powers don't work, but the Envoy doesn't seem to have any trouble. - 22:30 - The Envoy: For everything, if there's yin, there's yang. If there's good, then there's evil. Whether it's people of Haixing or Dixing, identity is just a flesh covering. But one's heart cannot be judged by one's identity alone.
万事万物有阴币有阳 有善必有恶海星也好 地星也罢身份只不过是一张皮囊可人心却不能只靠身份来判别
Partly, he's able to say this because of the SID asking him to save Butler Wu, Wu Tian'en last episode. I wonder if he's also partly driven by Zhao Yunlan's cutting response at the end of episode 4, when he said, "Hei Pao Shi daren enforces laws impartially. I spoke out of turn." 黑袍使大人秉公执法算是我多嘴了 Trying to balance Zhao Yunlan's view of him?
After the Envoy leaves the SID, Zhao Yunlan has a complicated expression. Is he dissatisfied at the outcome of the case? Feeling caught between what he knows is right and official Haixing policy? - Zhao Yunlan visits original Weiwei and catches her out. When she says, "But all of this should have been mine!" the camera crosses the line, as it so often does when people are mistaken or twisting events to suit themselves. (From the linked site: “When you [cross] the 180 degree line, you break the 180 degree rule and signal to the viewer that something is wrong.” It can be used to depict unease or a feeling that things are disorienting or out of control.)
Original Weiwei: Do you think this is my fault? 你说 这难道是我的错吗
Zhao Yunlan: I cannot judge if you are right or wrong, but, at the very least, there is someone with the same thoughts as you. 你错没错我也不好说 但至少有人跟你的想法是一样的
(I want him to be more judgy. ;-p) - The Envoy blames Mirror Girl for being like her father ("Greedy for prosperity. Encountering disaster because of love." 贪慕繁华因爱生劫) but he hasn't even heard her side of the story, and only last episode he was wrong about Wu Tian'en... I think there's some projection going on. And then she gives him a clue to the location of the Mountain-River Awl: "Forever guarding the territory (mountains and rivers) at the southern sky." 山河永镇 天南一方
(Btw, Google Translate turns 他曾是我的得力部下 肩负重要的职责 into "right-hand man" rather than "competent subordinate", which sounds better to me.) - Zhao Yunlan and Da Qing being casually physical and adorable on the couch and gossiping about Shen Wei!!! So much love!! (And ha, Zhao Yunlan says, "The person who can drug me hasn't been born yet," all unaware that he's going to be drugged in, like, three episodes.)
Da Qing observes that Zhao Yunlan has changed. "Didn't you say that you would arrest every Dixingren you see?" 不是说地星人见一个抓一个吗 - Da Qing quotes his ex-owner, which is one of those moments that is so much more meaningful on the rewatch, ahhhhhhh.
- 35:44 - Chu Shuzhi brings Shen Wei the banner. They're both kind of awkward and pained about it. How weird it must be for Shen Wei to have Chu Shuzhi show up in his office like this! (Especially when he's supposed to be distancing himself from the SID in the eyes of the university.) And how does Chu Shuzhi feel about being used as a messenger instead of a field agent? It's obvious the banner isn't sincere -- if it were, Zhao Yunlan would have delivered it himself (or given a much better thank-you gift!).
Watching on the video feed, Zhao Yunlan subconsciously starts to connect Shen Wei and the Envoy via Chu Shuzhi's attitude. I love this! It's smart, but very inconclusive, so it makes sense he discounts it to start with. And then Da Qing teases him by calling out, "Hei Pao Daren, Mr Zhao misses you!" and Zhao Yunlan kicks out at him, and I love them. - Zhao Yunlan listening in from the doorway on the Shen Wei & chancellor conversation about Li Qian dropping out -- makes me wonder how his school reacted to him after his mum died, especially if he suddenly Got Attitude. (Why is Zhao Yunlan ostensibly there, anyway? Just to hang around Shen Wei? Shen Wei doesn't ask -- so maybe Zhao Yunlan dropped in to tell him how the case unfolded, then Shen Wei heard about Li Qian and rushed over, and Zhao Yunlan followed along and lurked outside? But really, this is not helping with the chancellor's "professors shouldn't be seen with the SID" agenda.)
Discussion starters:
- What's your favourite part of the Mirror Girl case? How about the rest of the episode?
- In the first scene, when Zhao Yunlan stomps on Da Qing's foot (which I love), Chu Shuzhi doesn't laugh, just looks away. This is in contrast to him laughing at Zhao Yunlan getting zapped by Changcheng a few episodes later. Does he only laugh if it's an accident, or only if it's Zhao Yunlan? Or has he not unwound enough to laugh yet? (I think probably the latter?)
- Does Chu Shuzhi always carry beer in his pocket?
- When Shen Wei asks Ying Chun to help him find someone, does he mean the Mirror Girl or her father? Or the Awl?
- What does the Envoy mean when he says, "As you can see, it's usually a human heart that can defeat another heart." 你也看到了能过打败人心的往往只有人心自己? And do you think he should have let Mirror Girl stay in Haixing?
- Lin Jing finds Shen Wei's address, and Zhao Yunlan and Da Qing search the apartment. Zhao Yunlan says, "Not only does he live in our neighborhood, but he lives right in front of my apartment. How come I only saw him recently?" 原来他不仅住在我们家小区还跟我是对门那怎么这两天才碰到他呢 ... but Zhao Yunlan knows that Shen Wei only just moved, right? Is he speaking more existentially?
- Do you think Zhao Yunlan has any qualms about spying on Shen Wei? Does finding the SID file in Shen Wei's flat really justify any and all means of investigation?
- What's your favourite theory (headcanon or from fic) about how ZYL and DQ escape from Shen Wei's balcony?
- Re the mugging: why does Shen Wei carry so much cash? Is it just because everyone else pays via their phones, and he doesn't have one?
- Zhu Jiu keeps acting like he's orchestrating things, but how differently would most of these cases have gone without him (except for the face stealer one)?
Let’s talk about episode 6!
Come and talk about this episode – anything from favourite scenes or lines of dialogue to notes/questions about continuity or translation, most gorgeous (or angsty) smile, or anything else that strikes your fancy! And share links to your own and/or others’ episode-related meta, picspams, and fanworks, new or old!
Links to episode 6 fanworks and meta go here!
Link to your own works and/or others'. Help us build as comprehensive a collection of links as possible!
Re: Links to episode 6 fanworks and meta go here!
Character post about Ji Xiaobai, Mirror Girl, and Zhou Weiwei by me (includes a summary of their story, character descriptions, the outcome of their case, and themes and observations)
Annotated picspam about the Mirror Girl case by me
Zhao Yunlan consults Shen Wei about the Zhou Weiwei case, hosted by
Zhao Yunlan sends a smoke messenger to the Regent by me
Shen Wei and the chancellor talk about Li Qian, and Zhao Yunlan shows up by me
Guardian Episode by Episode: 6 by
Shadaras's episode reaction
My ep 6-related fic
the world outside, the world below - drabble series about Mirror Girl & Weiwei's backstory
Sharpen Up - Guo Changcheng & Chu Shuzhi talk about the case
Once Upon a Time in Dixing - The Envoy asks the SID to stage a jailbreak to rescue Ji Xiaobai from the Dixing palace prison, after he goes to rescue Mirror Girl
One Fish, Two Fish - after finding the SID file in Shen Wei's flat, Zhao Yunlan & Da Qing go and search his office
a little snippet of post-case Ji Xiaobai
ETA: Another Piece of the Puzzle - Zhao Yunlan needs to know how Shen Wei had ended up with an official SID file in his flat... so he breaks into the Xingdu Bureau, in search of more info. (4,758 words, G-rated, Zhao Xinci & Zhao Yunlan, background Shen Wei/Zhao Yunlan)
Squee and a link!
I also liked the twist that Ji Xiaobai's real fiancee was the mirror woman and not the original, but that led to such a sad ending. *sniff* (I love
How about the rest of the episode? I am here to squee about Chu Shuzhi's :hearteyes: when Guo Changcheng talks about being happy when everyone else is happy. It's a really lovely softening moment for Lao Chu, and a sweet moment between the two of them. We also get a tantalizing glimpse of Chu Shuzhi's backstory.
Link: Bonibaru's ChuGuo vid Brighter Than the Sun uses that moment (CSZ's hearteyes at GCC) at 1:06, for the line "'cause you're so damn beautiful."
Re: Squee and a link!
Ooh, yes, that was so good. :D
♥! (All the fixits for Ji Xiaobai and his Weiwei!)
I am here to squee about Chu Shuzhi's :hearteyes: when Guo Changcheng talks about being happy when everyone else is happy. It's a really lovely softening moment for Lao Chu, and a sweet moment between the two of them. We also get a tantalizing glimpse of Chu Shuzhi's backstory.
Yes to all of that, too! It really is the first time we see a crack in Chu Shuzhi's tough facade, isn't it (except perhaps when he meets with the Envoy). So good.
And that vid is really great. Thanks for linking! :D
no subject
I wouldn't say that it's a policy ... It's Shen Wei and Zhao Yunlan agreeing that Dixingren abusing their powers is their main problem – they agree on an ethical stance. But the official policy is still handing Dixingren over to the Envoy for judgment, with the expectation that he's taking them back to Dixing.
I still love that Chu Shuzhi is walking around with two cans of beer in his pocket and is completely unapologetic about not having enough for Changcheng.
Hee! I just love that Chu Shuzhi is randomly carrying beer around. I wonder what else he has in those pockets of his!
I will never not love Shen Wei portalling back to his office to meet Zhao Yunlan, and Zhao Yunlan being just about to give up and leave.
Yes! This is one of my favourite tiny easily-overlooked things. I love it. :D
When the wrong Weiwei comes back, Changcheng physically pushes Chu Shuzhi out of the room to give Weiwei and Ji Xiaobai some privacy. LOL.
Ha, yeah, I had totally forgotten about that. And poor GCC still not quite understanding what happened at the end, going by his journal entry! I wonder if anyone actually explains it to him at some point, or if some days or weeks later he suddenly wakes up and slaps his forehead, LOL.
And look, the wedding ring is another significant jewelry item!
Excellent point. It's an ongoing motif!
(Real Zhou Weiwei is very very bad at pretending to actually be Mirror Girl; did she really think that Ji Xiaobai wouldn't pick up on it if she acted nothing like her? And
I love when he references Shen Wei without saying his name -- it's a great way of showing how much Shen Wei is on his mind.
Yes, it's so delightful!
Partly, he's able to say this because of the SID asking him to save Butler Wu, Wu Tian'en last episode. I wonder if he's also partly driven by Zhao Yunlan's cutting response at the end of episode 4, when he said, "Hei Pao Shi daren enforces laws impartially. I spoke out of turn." 黑袍使大人秉公执法算是我多嘴了 Trying to balance Zhao Yunlan's view of him?
I think so, yeah – and you're right that it's the Wu Tian'en situation that allows him to actually say it. He wants Zhao Yunlan to understand him, of course, but he couldn't risk easing up too much on the Envoy's forbidding image until the SID had given some indication of easing up on Dixingren first …
And also, I think he's feeling ZYL out here a bit, trying to see if they feel the same about the Mirror Girl’s situation. I think ZYL's complicated expression afterwards shows just how conflicted he is about the whole thing, and I think Shen Wei is too. IMO they both know at that point which one was Ji Xiaobai's fiancée, even if not everyone else picks up on it. So there's sympathy for the whole Ji Xiaobai/not!Zhou Weiwei thing, but also the fact that she tried to blow them all up, and the question of whether Ji Xiaobai would have rejected her anyway once he knew the truth, and the Guardian Treaty on top of that. No easy answers here ...
I always wonder if Zhao Yunlan ever regrets pointing out not!Weiwei's lack of shadow in that mirror scene. Did he understand what was happening in that moment, or did he only realise when he’d already said it that it wasn't the real Zhou Weiwei who'd been with Ji Xiaobai?
I also like that this, after Zhang Ruonan and Wang Yike, is the second Dixing/Haixing couple. And this time, the Haixing partner only discovers the truth afterwards, and initially reacts badly. Different variations on a theme ...
The Envoy blames Mirror Girl for being like her father ("Greedy for prosperity. Encountering disaster because of love." 贪慕繁华因爱生劫) but he hasn't even heard her side of the story, and only last episode he was wrong about Wu Tian'en... I think there's some projection going on.
1) Where was he wrong about Wu Tian'en?
2) Yeah, he's definitely not seeing the whole picture here; he's reacting to her willingness to blow them all up. Trying to harm the one she supposedly loved – I think in Shen Wei's book, that's the most unforgivable thing. Wang Yike actually murdered people, but she did it in defence of the woman she loved, and she was distraught when Zhang Ruonan was harmed, so she has his sympathy. Not!Weiwei doesn't – and in the scene we have of her after her attempt, she doesn't seem to be feeling very bad about that in particular. Whether or not that's just because she's emotionally shut down, I think if she had, Shen Wei might have responded differently.
Zhao Yunlan and Da Qing being casually physical and adorable on the couch and gossiping about Shen Wei!!! So much love!!
Yes, I love the physicality of their affection, so delightful!
Watching on the video feed, Zhao Yunlan subconsciously starts to connect Shen Wei and the Envoy via Chu Shuzhi's attitude. I love this! It's smart, but very inconclusive, so it makes sense he discounts it to start with.
Yeah, and it's follow-up on Chu Shuzhi's own association of Shen Wei with the Envoy, in the interrogation scene. Very cool!
Why is Zhao Yunlan ostensibly there, anyway? Just to hang around Shen Wei? Shen Wei doesn't ask -- so maybe Zhao Yunlan dropped in to tell him how the case unfolded, then Shen Wei heard about Li Qian and rushed over, and Zhao Yunlan followed along and lurked outside?
Yeah, it's kind of bizarre – we see ZYL at the chancellor's office; then he walks with Shen Wei through some corridors while they talk about incidental things, and then Shen Wei says good-bye. I like your explanation that they actually talked before Shen Wei went to see the chancellor, and ZYL was nosy and followed him there. :D
What's your favourite part of the Mirror Girl case? How about the rest of the episode?
The consultation with the joint "Mirror!" I just love that one so much, the banter ("are you complaining?" – "not really, but if I did, I'd totally be in the right!"), the way Zhao Yunlan leans forward and slouches on the table, looking up through his eyelashes at Shen Wei; the synchronised speaking of the crucial clue! DELIGHTFUL.
(Also the way that Zhao Yunlan later remembers Shen Wei's words, proving that the scene went on for longer than we got to see!)
Does he only laugh if it's an accident, or only if it's Zhao Yunlan? Or has he not unwound enough to laugh yet? (I think probably the latter?)
I think he hasn't unwound enough yet, but also, he's definitely more likely to laugh at Zhao Yunlan – he enjoys poking at him. (It keeps happening in several episodes!)
When Shen Wei asks Ying Chun to help him find someone, does he mean the Mirror Girl or her father? Or the Awl?
I think it's the Awl via Mirror Girl – he knows her father is dead; he's looking for the guy's family in order to find clues about the Awl. Why he thinks the guy knew, I have no idea, though – and even less why he's right. Damn, I wish someone would come out with a fanfic version of events 20 years ago that manages to fit together all these puzzle pieces! Seriously, this bit of backstory is one of the things I most regret not getting in the actual drama ...
What does the Envoy mean when he says, "As you can see, it's usually a human heart that can defeat another heart." 你也看到了能过打败人心的往往只有人心自己? And do you think he should have let Mirror Girl stay in Haixing?
I think that's a weird translation; there's no “another” in the original – it's "what defeats the human heart is usually the human heart itself". Solo's subs have it as "As you can see, people are usually defeated by their own heart", and that sounds much closer to me.
As for letting Mirror Girl stay – it struck me this time that the last time we see her, talking to the Envoy, is still in Haixing, and he never outright says he's taking her to Dixing. So do we know for certain that he doesn't let her go? (Though I think, given how ready she was to use her powers in a destructive way, he has reason to take her to Dixing.)
I do think she and Ji Xiaobai deserve a chance, but they both have things to overcome, and of course there's real!Zhou Weiwei around now, which doesn't make things easier ...
Zhao Yunlan says, "Not only does he live in our neighborhood, but he lives right in front of my apartment. How come I only saw him recently?" 原来他不仅住在我们家小区还跟我是对门那怎么这两天才碰到他呢 ... but Zhao Yunlan knows that Shen Wei only just moved, right? Is he speaking more existentially?
He actually says "why did I meet him only two days ago", and that must have been the jogging scene where he found out Shen Wei had moved into the neighbourhood. It would make sense if Shen Wei had moved in a little earlier than that, even just a week or so, but that episode really doesn't look that way. Very strange!
Do you think Zhao Yunlan has any qualms about spying on Shen Wei? Does finding the SID file in Shen Wei's flat really justify any and all means of investigation?
I think he definitely doesn't have enough qualms, so I'm glad it will come back to bite him. The spy camera is a huge invasion of privacy – not just Shen Wei's, but any student's and any other person's who might come to Shen Wei's office!
What's your favourite theory (headcanon or from fic) about how ZYL and DQ escape from Shen Wei's balcony?
After Shen Wei realises who's in his flat and smiles to himself, he pretends to notice nothing, then goes into the bathroom and turns on the shower. Zhao Yunlan and Da Qing use the opportunity to sneak out of the flat. Shen Wei smiles to himself again.
I think I first came across this in a fic, but I can’t remember exactly. It was a long time ago!
(Also, I still hate the suit Shen Wei wears in that scene!)
Re the mugging: why does Shen Wei carry so much cash? Is it just because everyone else pays via their phones, and he doesn't have one?
That seems likely!
Zhu Jiu keeps acting like he's orchestrating things, but how differently would most of these cases have gone without him (except for the face stealer one)?
Obviously the attacks on Li Qian wouldn't have happened without Zhu Jiu orchestrating them, and after that, it seems like a lot of the people involved - especially later - are ones Zhu Jiu tracked down and set on their targets. I'm not sure if Wang Yike is one of them, though – it sounded to me like he was only planning to approach her? If he'd already been on to Shen Wei, I'd have said he might have been the one to stoke her suspicions against him, but Zhu Jiu doesn't seem to discover Shen Wei until the very end of that case. I do think Wu Xiaojun is one of the people Zhu Jiu tracked down, though, so who knows if he'd ever have returned to his father if Zhu Jiu hadn't put him on the path of revenge. Mirror Girl seems entirely unrelated again.
no subject
Yeah, I meant unofficially. It's obviously not the official Haixing line, or the official Dixing one. I wonder if/when the rest of the team find out about the change, and how they feel about it. I'd love to have seen CSZ's reaction, in particular.
And poor GCC still not quite understanding what happened at the end, going by his journal entry! I wonder if anyone actually explains it to him at some point, or if some days or weeks later he suddenly wakes up and slaps his forehead, LOL.
Right? Heh. (I wrote fic about CSZ explaining it to him, fwiw.)
And
Absolutely! So shameless. And I totally agree about her terrible acting. She's been watching their relationship the whole time -- you'd think she'd be better at it. ;-p (There must be some narrative causality in there, so we can pick up on the switch.)
And also, I think he's feeling ZYL out here a bit, trying to see if they feel the same about the Mirror Girl’s situation.
*nodnod* Agreed. And yeah, I think they both know at that point what's going on. The moment when Ji Xiaobai correctly IDed his Weiwei was a clincher, I think, even if no one had figured it out before.
I always wonder if Zhao Yunlan ever regrets pointing out not!Weiwei's lack of shadow in that mirror scene. Did he understand what was happening in that moment, or did he only realise when he’d already said it that it wasn't the real Zhou Weiwei who'd been with Ji Xiaobai?
That's a great question! *rewatches* I think Zhao Yunlan definitely knows when Ji Xiaobai chooses her, and he's testing them. If Ji Xiaobai had stood by her anyway, I wonder what ZYL would have done. It's a complicated situation, politically and emotionally -- would he have had the heart to tear the lovers apart? (
I also like that this, after Zhang Ruonan and Wang Yike, is the second Dixing/Haixing couple. And this time, the Haixing partner only discovers the truth afterwards, and initially reacts badly. Different variations on a theme ...
Yeah, it's great. Such good parallels and setting up for SW/ZYL. (Oh, I wonder if Shen Wei is comparing everyone to the gold standard of Kunlun, who showed up and was 1000% admiring and supportive and on his side? Ha.)
1) Where was he wrong about Wu Tian'en?
I thought he initially approached Wu Tian'en as if he were an antagonist. He was all, "You betrayed me twenty years ago, but it's water under the bridge now, and I'm not here for retribution. Just don't touch ZYL." And then Wu Tian'en fell to his knees, and Shen Wei realised he wasn't disloyal after all?
and in the scene we have of her after her attempt, she doesn't seem to be feeling very bad about that in particular. Whether or not that's just because she's emotionally shut down, I think if she had, Shen Wei might have responded differently.
Still hurt by JXB's calling her a monster, I think. Aware the time's up on her deal with original!Weiwei.
It's such a complicated situation, because she is trying to break her deal, but original!Weiwei is such a pill and so greedy for things that don't belong to her... it's much easier to sympathise with Mirror Girl.
Yeah, and it's follow-up on Chu Shuzhi's own association of Shen Wei with the Envoy, in the interrogation scene.
Oh, true. Good point!
the way Zhao Yunlan leans forward and slouches on the table, looking up through his eyelashes at Shen Wei
akdhflkajsdflaksjdfhalkdjsfhaksjdfhldsjhfldksjfhasdkfjasdf and all the lollipop action, too!!!! a;slkfja;dlkfjasd
I think he hasn't unwound enough yet, but also, he's definitely more likely to laugh at Zhao Yunlan – he enjoys poking at him. (It keeps happening in several episodes!)
Yeah, true, like when they're looking at the CCTV of the mugging. I was thinking about that, too. I think, on CSZ's side, they're actually becoming as-close-to-friends-as-CSZ-has-experienced-in-Haixing. Whereas Zhao Yunlan has Da Qing, so for him it's less of a big deal, I think?
I think that's a weird translation; there's no “another” in the original – it's "what defeats the human heart is usually the human heart itself". Solo's subs have it as "As you can see, people are usually defeated by their own heart", and that sounds much closer to me.
Still, it seems a pretty pessimistic/bitter stance for the Envoy to take, especially if he's also applying it to himself, you know? Especially when he and ZYL are starting to reach an accord. Hm.
I think he definitely doesn't have enough qualms, so I'm glad it will come back to bite him. The spy camera is a huge invasion of privacy – not just Shen Wei's, but any student's and any other person's who might come to Shen Wei's office!
Right? /o\
After Shen Wei realises who's in his flat and smiles to himself, he pretends to notice nothing, then goes into the bathroom and turns on the shower. Zhao Yunlan and Da Qing use the opportunity to sneak out of the flat. Shen Wei smiles to himself again.
*nodnod* I think I've seen that in fic, too. (I'm thinking of an AU by
(Also, I still hate the suit Shen Wei wears in that scene!)
It's so bad! I don't even notice clothes much, and it's painful to look at.
I do think Wu Xiaojun is one of the people Zhu Jiu tracked down, though, so who knows if he'd ever have returned to his father if Zhu Jiu hadn't put him on the path of revenge.
Oh, I hadn't thought of that. Cool! That might explain why Xiaojun turns on Shen Wei later, too. Maybe Zhu Jiu turned him into a sleeper agent (like Changcheng later in the show)? Because he does seem here like he's repented and reformed, and should be on good terms with the SID and the Envoy for saving his dad.
no subject
Oh, that makes more sense! Because you said "SID" and not "Zhao Yunlan", it sounded more official to me. Yeah, that's a good question, I'd love to know what everyone else thinks about all of this, Zhao Yunlan's shifting attitudes and the way it affects all their work ... Da Qing explicitly comments on it in this episode, how Zhao Yunlan used to be all "arrest every Dixingren" and now he's "but he did nothing wrong", but the others must be noticing it too.
I wrote fic about CSZ explaining it to him, fwiw.
Oh, yes, I vaguely remember that!
There must be some narrative causality in there, so we can pick up on the switch.
And so we don't sympathise too much with her, too?
I think Zhao Yunlan definitely knows when Ji Xiaobai chooses her, and he's testing them.
What makes you think he knows in that moment? I'm not disagreeing, I'm just not entirely sure myself, and I'm curious what decided you.
(I'm not sure he's testing them. We've already talked about how he's not been showing much empathy early on, both with Li Qian and especially in the Wang Yike case until the very end - how he's more focused on figuring things out and exposing the truth than worrying about the human consequences. I wonder if this isn't another case of that.)
If Ji Xiaobai had stood by her anyway, I wonder what ZYL would have done.
I don't know what he could have done, even if she'd never tried to explode anything and the Envoy had never appeared. The real Zhou Weiwei is right there as well, after all, and they can't exactly make her go away. Or take her identity away from her.
Oh, I wonder if Shen Wei is comparing everyone to the gold standard of Kunlun, who showed up and was 1000% admiring and supportive and on his side? Ha.
Haha, yeah, there's probably a bit of that in there! :D
I thought he initially approached Wu Tian'en as if he were an antagonist. He was all, "You betrayed me twenty years ago, but it's water under the bridge now, and I'm not here for retribution. Just don't touch ZYL." And then Wu Tian'en fell to his knees, and Shen Wei realised he wasn't disloyal after all?
Ah. I didn't read it quite that way. I thought he approached Wu Tian'en with suspicion, but that's not the same as being wrong, so I didn't catch your meaning. I see what you mean now!
Still hurt by JXB's calling her a monster, I think. Aware the time's up on her deal with original!Weiwei.
Yes, absolutely! Her reaction, or lack thereof, is completely understandable.
It's such a complicated situation, because she is trying to break her deal, but original!Weiwei is such a pill and so greedy for things that don't belong to her... it's much easier to sympathise with Mirror Girl.
Yeah, this. It's hard to sympathise with someone who's behaving so appallingly.
Yeah, true, like when they're looking at the CCTV of the mugging. I was thinking about that, too. I think, on CSZ's side, they're actually becoming as-close-to-friends-as-CSZ-has-experienced-in-Haixing. Whereas Zhao Yunlan has Da Qing, so for him it's less of a big deal, I think?
And I remember a bit in the Hanga arc, and in the cage fighting case, and probably more I'm not thinking of right now! Yeah, I think for CSZ, it matters a lot more than it does for ZYL. Though IMO it's not just the friendliness, it's also the respect.
Still, it seems a pretty pessimistic/bitter stance for the Envoy to take, especially if he's also applying it to himself, you know? Especially when he and ZYL are starting to reach an accord. Hm.
Idk, it doesn't read as pessimistic or bitter to me, because if you're doing it to yourself, you have some control over that and can stop yourself, unlike outside circumstances which you may not be able to change ...
(I'm thinking of an AU by teaotter and the comments thereon.)
Thanks for the link! Not my sort of AU, but the comment thread is exactly what I'm picturing, yeah. :D
That might explain why Xiaojun turns on Shen Wei later, too. Maybe Zhu Jiu turned him into a sleeper agent (like Changcheng later in the show)? Because he does seem here like he's repented and reformed, and should be on good terms with the SID and the Envoy for saving his dad.
I thought Wu Xiaojun turned on Shen Wei because he was under Ye Zun's mind control power. But his previous contact with Zhu Jiu could have made him more susceptible to that ...
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Yeah, I'm sure that's part of it.
What makes you think he knows in that moment? I'm not disagreeing, I'm just not entirely sure myself, and I'm curious what decided you.
Before that, they overhear the two women arguing. Weiwei asks for the ring, and Mirror Girl says, "I gave you everything. Why can't you leave me with a souvenir?" Weiwei says, "It's impossible between you and him." I think ZYL has enough info at that point. And then Weiwei runs to JXB, and when MG comes into view, ZYL holds CSZ back from intervening. Plus I think ZYL is too insightful not to realise that Mirror Girl's "You don't recognise me?" is genuine. When JXB walks towards MG, you can kind of see ZYL working it out/confirming it for himself in the background.
When he catches Weiwei out later, it's more for JXB's benefit than his own, imo. I think he already knows.
I'm not sure he's testing them. We've already talked about how he's not been showing much empathy early on, both with Li Qian and especially in the Wang Yike case until the very end - how he's more focused on figuring things out and exposing the truth than worrying about the human consequences. I wonder if this isn't another case of that.
But a lot has happened since the start. I think he's curious to know if there's genuine feeling between them (whether there can be genuine feeling between them, or whether Wang Yike and Teacher Zhang were an anomaly). He has to consciously or subconsciously be drawing parallels with his suspicions about Shen Weii and his feelings for him, too, I think?
I don't know what he could have done, even if she'd never tried to explode anything and the Envoy had never appeared. The real Zhou Weiwei is right there as well, after all, and they can't exactly make her go away. Or take her identity away from her.
I guess it depends on whether they can both exist outside the mirror (it looks like they can, but maybe that's only for short periods of time?). If they can both live in the world, surely it's easy enough to give one or the other of them a new identity?
> Still hurt by JXB's calling her a monster, I think. Aware the time's up on her deal with original!Weiwei.
Yes, absolutely! Her reaction, or lack thereof, is completely understandable.
Rewatching, I realised he doesn't actually call her a monster -- that's all Weiwei. JXB reacts with fear, but he doesn't denounce her or anything.
Idk, it doesn't read as pessimistic or bitter to me, because if you're doing it to yourself, you have some control over that and can stop yourself
Only if you can control your heart -- and who can? Idk, it sounds kind of fatalistic to me.
But his previous contact with Zhu Jiu could have made him more susceptible to that ...
Yeah, that's what I meant. :-)
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That makes sense, thank you!
He has to consciously or subconsciously be drawing parallels with his suspicions about Shen Weii and his feelings for him, too, I think?
Huh, I never thought of it that way. I'm not sure he's putting himself into Ji Xiaobai's place here ...
I guess it depends on whether they can both exist outside the mirror (it looks like they can, but maybe that's only for short periods of time?). If they can both live in the world, surely it's easy enough to give one or the other of them a new identity?
Yeah, I'm pretty sure they can both exist outside the mirror, but that's the thing - it wouldn't just be a case of letting her go. Zhao Yunlan would have to actively help Mirror Girl get a new fake identity, all the while hiding her existence from the official record and his own superiors at the Ministry, including falsifying the documentation for the case. That would be a lot, especially this early on! I don't think he's anywhere near ready to make that kind of decision yet. Not to mention that all of would depend on original!Weiwei's cooperation, which she doesn't look likely to give.
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Not explicitly. I didn't mean that. But curious about personal relationships between the races, and about Dixingren generally, I think? And it does have personal implications.
it wouldn't just be a case of letting her go. Zhao Yunlan would have to actively help Mirror Girl get a new fake identity, all the while hiding her existence from the official record and his own superiors at the Ministry, including falsifying the documentation for the case.
Plus the Envoy would have to agree. ZYL currently has no reason to think he might. It would be complicated, but ZYL was prepared to risk personal harm to save Wu Tian'en, and he did tell the Envoy, "No matter if it's a regular person or a Dixingren, a person is a person." If JXB and MG were both pleading, I think he'd try to do something. ETA: And if it was an unorthodox solution that made him seem sneaky and clever, I think he'd enjoy that side of it, too. ;-p
Btw, in terms of fatalism, I meant a passing sense of it, like in the car in episode 2, when he says perhaps there's no turning back. I don't think he's fatalistic by nature. (I was going to ETA my comment, but didn't get there in time. :-)
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Zhu Jiu's orchestration is really just searching out disaffected people and going "hey what if you did a thing for me? I can pay you." xD <3
I think it's extremely funny to have Chu Shuzhi give Shen Wei the ugly spy banner, both because Chu Shuzhi is so out of place in a university and because Chu Shuzhi is going to be belatedly horrified about the whole thing once he realises Shen Wei is HPS.
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Oh, yeah, definitely!
Plus the Envoy would have to agree. ZYL currently has no reason to think he might.
Yeah, and ZYL would have to bring it up to the Envoy himself, because without Mirror Girl's explosive power the Envoy wouldn't be involved. Even later, when he definitely had more reason to think the Envoy would be sympathetic, he was pissed off about the Envoy taking Zheng Yi away but didn't actually try to stop it.
And yeah, if Mirror Girl and Ji Xiaobai were pleading and Zhao Yunlan had a brilliant idea that could actually help them without opening another whole can of worms, then he might, but I really have trouble coming up with anything. Sometimes there's just no good solution.
(Besides, I like the thematic mirroring - separated lovers is another recurring motif, after all - so it's even better if they do get separated and then find each other again! *g*)
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That's what the mirror world looks like before the Envoy appears, though? The golden sparkles and the black-and-red flecks of ashes or whatever it is. Or am I missing something here?
Zhu Jiu's orchestration is really just searching out disaffected people and going "hey what if you did a thing for me? I can pay you." xD <3
Haha, yeah. How does he find all these people?! He should have been a private investigator instead, he's really good at it!
Chu Shuzhi is going to die of embarrassment later, but I really value that scene of him and Shen Wei staring at each other over that banner, both with their best poker faces, pretending this is normal. *g*
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I think he means he doesn’t see Shen Wei as frequently as you would expect to see a neighbor. So he’s accusing Shen Wei of avoiding him deliberately – how suspicious!
Do you think Zhao Yunlan has any qualms about spying on Shen Wei? Does finding the SID file in Shen Wei's flat really justify any and all means of investigation?
Absolutely not justified. But I guess Zhao Yunlan doesn’t quite play by the rules anyway. I think he has no qualms.
The SID file is pretty tame compared to what he finds when he breaks into Shen Wei’s apartment in the novel :P
What's your favourite theory (headcanon or from fic) about how ZYL and DQ escape from Shen Wei's balcony?
They wait until Shen Wei goes to bed – he stays up extra late specifically to annoy them.
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I'm more likely to be missing something. I just know I never notice the black floaty bits until HPS shows up. :)
Haha, yeah. How does he find all these people?! He should have been a private investigator instead, he's really good at it!
xD That'd be quite the AU! Also very funny, since in that context he'd be a really useful ally for the SID to have, since he's so good at specifically searching out dixingren... I suppose Ye Zun might be helping him find those people somehow, but it's funnier if he's actually just good at this specific thing on his own.
Chu Shuzhi is going to die of embarrassment later, but I really value that scene of him and Shen Wei staring at each other over that banner, both with their best poker faces, pretending this is normal. *g*
Same! :D
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Moving into their neighbourhood deliberately, and then avoiding them! That is pretty weird.
But I guess Zhao Yunlan doesn’t quite play by the rules anyway. I think he has no qualms.
Yeah, agreed. I think he thinks his whole job is a grey area.
The SID file is pretty tame compared to what he finds when he breaks into Shen Wei’s apartment in the novel :P
Ooh, is that the necklace of teeth or something else? I haven't read the novel.
They wait until Shen Wei goes to bed – he stays up extra late specifically to annoy them.
Hee! Bonus, the longer Shen Wei keeps Zhao Yunlan trapped on his balcony, the less other trouble Zhao Yunlan can get into! *g*
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Zhu Jiu's orchestration is really just searching out disaffected people and going "hey what if you did a thing for me? I can pay you." xD <3
Haha, so true. And as Trobadora says, he is super good at finding them. Maybe he has someone with a grudge-detecting power on retainer...
I think it's extremely funny to have Chu Shuzhi give Shen Wei the ugly spy banner, both because Chu Shuzhi is so out of place in a university and because Chu Shuzhi is going to be belatedly horrified about the whole thing once he realises Shen Wei is HPS.
LOL, I think he's pretty horrified already. So awkward! *g*
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It’s an elaborate shrine dedicated to himself (or technically Kunlun), complete with a romantic poem.
Fun Fact: That was actually the scene that made me ship these two.
Hee! Bonus, the longer Shen Wei keeps Zhao Yunlan trapped on his balcony, the less other trouble Zhao Yunlan can get into! *g*
A genius plan, as expected of HPS XD
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Ha!
:D :D :D
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Oh, that makes more sense, thank you! Yeah, "he moved in right next to me and then I basically never see him, WTF is up with that" is a valid complaint!
They wait until Shen Wei goes to bed – he stays up extra late specifically to annoy them.
Haha, I love that! Troll Shen Wei strikes again! :D
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I always wondered why finding the file didn't send him on a search at the ministry to see who might have given Shen Wei that file. Presumably Shen Wei got it via some kind of 'Envoy asks for information' pipeline, not that we ever see that again...
What's your favourite theory (headcanon or from fic) about how ZYL and DQ escape from Shen Wei's balcony?
My favourite theory is that Shen Wei putters around for a while to let them stew a bit and then leaves again so they can escape back to Zhao Yunlan's apartment. Making a gentle point (if only to himself), no matter how pleased he is by Zhao Yunlan's interest.
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My favourite theory is that Shen Wei putters around for a while to let them stew a bit and then leaves again so they can escape back to Zhao Yunlan's apartment. Making a gentle point (if only to himself), no matter how pleased he is by Zhao Yunlan's interest.
Hee! That sounds about right to me. He has the upper hand -- he can't just fold immediately. *g*
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Oooh! What a fabulous idea, I never thought of that but it would make a lot of sense, if he could be sneaky enough about it! I'd love to see Zhao Yunlan investigating the Ministry (and maybe uncovering other stuff in the process)!
Also, I'm loving all the different versions of how Shen Wei might deal with the balcony situation. They're all delightful! :D
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Definitely cheering you on for this. You can do it! *g*
Re: Links to episode 6 fanworks and meta go here!